Mk 3 Coaches for Repainting - Lima vs. Hornby

[DJ Dangerous]

Hi All.

I'm thinking of trying to repaint some Mk3 coaches into IE livery.

Why are the Hornby coaches so much shorter than Lima / Silver Fox?

It would be my first time attempting anything like this, so I would like to try some cheap, used ones rather than destroy something expensive.

Which length is more accurate?

Thank you!

[NIRCLASS80]

The Hornby shorties are the wrong length. 

The longer coaches from all the companies (Lima, Hornby, Oxford) are more or less the correct length. 

They all have the incorrect doors and some different window configuration. 

My rule of thumb is the easiest ones for dissembling and if they look ok for your layout. 

I went for the full length Hornby version. 

Seen here in action  

 

Edited September 17, 2019 by NIRCLASS80

[Glenderg]

The Hornby MK3 "Shorties" were brought to market in a bid to squash more stock on your average layout. The awful tinted windows and of course the length, are the giveaway. The window pane all along the bodyside is a single piece of clear glazing and is just awful. There's nowhere to mask off for window opening, so bang those ladies back on fleabay for an easy life. Have a go on one of them though, then take yer learning onto the correct length coaches. 

The standard foot long-ish Hornby version is a one piece body mould, but if I recall correctly, the glazing is superglue bonded to the interior of the coach and is near impossible to remove without breakages, so you'd have to use liquid masking fluid or similar to respray and save the glazing. 

Best of the lot is the old Lima's, in my humble opinion. It's a softer plastic than the hornby one, so any mods to roof or ends are straightforward, with less threat of personal injury. The Oxford coaches have some serious profile issues with the prototype, so wouldn't advocate that route. 

HTH

Richie

 

[Rob]

Yeah, echo the above points.     

Eight windows on the Standards is the accurate numbers for IÉ version although the doors won't be accurate as @NIRCLASS80 says-  go for what works on your layout & practice on a Hornby shortie first.

Good luck & look forward to seeing the work!

[DJ Dangerous]

Thank you for the replies, and the detailed info.

I suspect that part of Hornby's reasoning was to allow them navigate first radius curves easily, as I'm running them right now and there is massive clearance.

I will practice on them at some stage while collecting longer Mk3's to one day work on.

As I have only a tiny layout, and run first radius curves, the short coaches will probably have a life here either way.

[RedRich]

I've always felt that the Lima model was the one that captured the look and profile best. It is let down like the Hornby  model with the abysmal representation of the corridor connection gangway. The Oxford MK111 as has been said above by Richie is let down by poor profile and the under carriage dimensions are all over the place. However the gangway corridor connector is the best aspect of the model and captures it best of all the models so far released. The Lima can be taken up a level by using Shawplan laserglaze and etched window surrounds.

HTH good luck.

Rich,

[Dempsey]

I'm in the process of repainting Jouff mk3 coaches right now. Waiting finish painting them all before applying decals but like mentioned above the hornby rake i which were my first attempt at painting are noticeably shorter

[Past-Avenue]

Hi i done some off the old short Hornby ones but they look ok on my small layout and my first attempt and i just need to weather them a little now 

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

What brand of paint and colour are you chaps using?  Looks like repainting MK3s is the only way I'll be getting any... (Fran are you listening?)

[DJ Dangerous]

Wow, some gorgeous looking coaches there Dempsey and Past-Avenue!

 

1 hour ago, Dr Gerbil-Fritters said:

What brand of paint and colour are you chaps using?  Looks like repainting MK3s is the only way I'll be getting any... (Fran are you listening?)

I went to my mechanic and ordered a can of RAL2011, as things like that are not readily available over here.

Hope to try some repainting on my day off next week.

Edited November 10, 2019 by DJ Dangerous
Spellllling

[Past-Avenue]

Thanks DJ Dangerous 

I used RAL 2011 on the MK3s and RAL 2001 for my super train coaches that my local motor factors were able to mix up but the only problem i had was the nozzle was not great and i used one off another brand to get a finer coat off paint other than that it worked ok .

[Rob]

Looks great-  we don't see enough Mark 3's so always great to see them!   

[Dempsey]

On 11/10/2019 at 3:08 PM, DJ Dangerous said:

Wow, some gorgeous looking coaches there Dempsey and Past-Avenue!

 

I went to my mechanic and ordered a can of RAL2011, as things like that are not readily available over here.

Hope to try some repainting on my day off next week.

I used white primer for the lines, satin black and the orange is RAL2011. The decals are from railtec

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Who makes RAL2011?  I can't find it as a rattlecan...

[flange lubricator]

Any motor factors with a paint mixing scheme should be able to mix you up a can on request. 

[DJ Dangerous]

On 11/11/2019 at 6:13 PM, flange lubricator said:

Any motor factors with a paint mixing scheme should be able to mix you up a can on request. 

Yeah, I got my mechanic to order some RAL2011 from his supplier.

So the Mk3's ran in RAL2001 Supertrain livery, then RAL2011 Intercity livery, and nothing else?

[burnthebox]

On 11 November 2019 at 5:10 PM, Dr Gerbil-Fritters said:

Who makes RAL2011?  I can't find it as a rattlecan...

I don't know where your based but this guy should be able to get you almost any mix you tell him or send to him, he's based in South Dublin,

BTB

https://www.vinnybyrne.com

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Paint order placed with Vinny, cheers BTB.

Now to find a suitable Mark 3!

[Noel]

Just as a matter of interest what are 'Hornby Shorties'? Also aside from being shorter than scale length is there anything else that is  materially different about them (eg no of windows, etc)? Where can 'Hornby Shorties be got (ie Hornby R-Number, or range name)? Thanks.

Am considering respraying some but wondering if shorter coaches might look better in a longer rake of coaches, especially rounding curves without massive overhang on curves and crossing points, etc. Just a thought.

[Past-Avenue]

Hi Noel 

Mine are Hornby Shorties witch i believe are R4084 and are old Hornby ones.

You can see them in the video in my post on this tread .

I think that they look fine on my size off a layout .

Enda 

[Rob]

'Shorties' were the Mark 3's produced by Hornby for smaller layouts to fit more on.   

They differed from the 'correct' real life version in that they were too short (obviously!) and the Standards had 7 windows instead of 8.   

The doors are 'wrong' aswell but no model has the correct door config. for the lrish version.

Whatever suits though l guess!

Edited November 25, 2019 by Rob

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

I think the shorties are built differently from normal coaches. Instead of a complete shell with insert windows, I think they have a transparent insert the whole length of the coach with the windows printed on. Looking at examples on ebay the fit of the transparent insert is often poor ruining the smooth sided appearance of the mark 3. I have 30 inch curves and my full length mark 3 pp set looks ok.  They're such distinctive  coaches I can live with incorrect doors but not incorrect length. 

[Dempsey]

Have the weekend to myself so I'll be finishing the rest of my resprays, applying decals and some weathering to the frame. I'll post some pictures later of the completed work

[Dempsey]

The first three in the make shift spray booth i.e. cardboard box. Decals applied and first stage of weathering done. I know it's not for everyone but i personally think it adds to the detail. I'm going for a these couches are not far off needing to visit the wash look. Had some mix left over so thought i'd try a loco so since 210 is going to be hauling this rake i figured i'd give it ago. Thoughts and comments as always appreciated. 

[Dempsey]

Three down, four to go and first attempt at weathering a loco done.