Westport Quay and the Project 42 Inglenook

Sean · July 10, 2022

Although the other layout is not yet finished, I have been talking myself into building a small inglenook that could be Placed ontop of the main fish tank in the living room as a place to display rolling stock on.

Well ambitions have gotten the better of me and that idea has now morphed into somthing a good bit larger.

Had been looking for a prototypical location to base it on which narrowed me down to 2 completely different scenes. either the south facing yard at greystones (omitting any kind of station), or westport quay and branchline to the dock(also omitting the station except for the loading platforms). I also did not like fintona, as unusually i did not want to have a run around loop due to space constrains. however in the end it was realised that without it a very long headshunt would be needed regardless so tried to squeeze one in as best i could.

Greystones would be simple, but westport has been a favourite of mine since getting back into the hobby and would give the opportunity to model a real bit of "countryside" rather than having a layout completely centric around a yard on station. we all love wesport to the point that it has been done to death, but its a very versatile little terminus.

SO i got to work on making the smallest iteration of this plan that i could with the following constraints: it has to be built from existing in stock track and it must follow the rules of the inglenook game. it also MUST incorporate the dock scene to be located in such a way that it does not feel incredibly bunched in ontop of the station and as part of the same facility. a LOT to ask but i have an 8 foot wall off of the slaney lake fiddleyard, so it has been designed to fit into this space. taking this length into consideration, and the fact that I still want a fish tank display piece, I have designed to build the layout over 3 baseboards which I will A. allow me to work in phases, B keep a module downstairs as i am working on it or to be left as the display piece whilst i am building the others and C allow me to later make other modules which could extend or change scenes within the layout as i will explain below.

The track on the right at 250 will be the existing fiddleyard which will be laid with traffic from both layouts in mind and a clear thru road for layout to layout running.

The dock module on the left will be quite simple with an extended single track down to a small dock area built to accomodate 3 wagons plus a locomotive with the level crossing gate shut, this module will be built first to later become the living room piece if and when desired. it also allows for a small branch off through bare boggy land to the docks and creates a feeling of seperation between the dock and station. short 3 wagon loads can be pushed and pulled from the dock which in real life would be a couple of miles away.

the middle board is essentially westport quay station. scaled down to as small a size as possible whilst maintaining the rules of inglenook. the headshunt will be big enough for loco+3 and the siding will just accomodate 5 wagons. the station house and platform have long since closed and all that will remain is a old abandoned platform with plenty of weeds etc growing up out of it. Quite often we see stations modelled in quite a detailed fashion with the yard areas either omitted or very much scaled down. I want to challenge this concept by focusing on the goods, with passengers being an afterthought or simply nonexistent, this makes sense from another point of view also.

Era wise I am aiming to be around 1970s with the main stars being my supertrain 121 and 141's But a caveat to this is that i also have a grey 121 which i am wishing to run on this(and BNT on the shopping list) and lets face it is going to see all manner of stock when connected to my other layout so the era is simply going to be "loose goods" and left at that. lack of any station signage and only generic sort of road and dock signs from the general period should mean that by lifting all of the cars and rolling stock and changing them for those from a given decade means i will be able to change between given eras depending on what i want to operate at the time.. my other layout is very rigidly sticking to half of a certain decade whilst this one will allow me a bit more freedom in that regard.

the railcar will also operate on occasion to the abandoned halt. but rarely.

the station also has a through road. meaning with given space the middle module and right modules could in time be used with a continuous loop of track to create a round and round circuit.

The third board is mainly just a means to connect to the fiddle yard with some space left over for some boggy fields.

the loop is on a bend and squeezed into a tight space im mostly planning on running dapol loose coupled stuff, with the slightly bigger couplings so im not as worried about issues here but it is a concern. running older stock like this also means it should be more forgiving on the hornby trackwork, which is once again reluctantly being used but actually makes sense for this one.

Another version of the third board will also eventually be built which will just be a bufferstop and headshunt with no connection to another layout. for standalone use should i ever want to use the layout away from home.

Plans wise its pretty simple. I'll get all my baseboards built at once, decide on an underlay system and lay all of the track, from there ill split the layout back up and build a board at a time starting with the docks. Expect progress to slow as i am still finishing the other layout but the boards and trackwork should happen quickly enough.

Edited February 20, 2023 by Sean

jhb171achill · July 10, 2022

Superb concept, superb operational potential. Looking forward to this.

meathdane · July 10, 2022

Looks the job! I really like the design of it!

Sean · July 14, 2022

as anticipated the baseboard and trackwork have happened very rapidly indeed! Minor trackwork adjustments as always but the overall plan has not changed and the dock module has a straight transition to the other board. The compact size means two of the boards can be permanently joined for improved point running.

Some placeholder buildings and platforms gone in the usual stuff that may change in time.

My priority here is finalizing the trackwork so I can break away the dock module and work on it exclusively for a while. I also need to find a reliable way to join/split this module and keep the track aligned.

I can get the dock module progressed fairly fast as I have most of the items to finish it in stock Except for some scalescenes buildings I still need to print.

Deutz at the dock!

132 shunts accross bog land!

was torn on whether I will buy or make the dock walls and cobbles. I have some nicely sized polystyrene bits in stock and loads.of filler so I said I'd see what I could rustle up after a few YouTube videos.

First and second attempts respectively. Very pleased with the second attempt and I might salvage the first one yet as the filler is very forgiving (it's also rock hard in under two hours!) Should look the part once painted up and washed.

Even a light sand from here I am thinking would work wonders on them but that's for tomorrow to know and me to find out.

On 10/7/2022 at 4:20 AM, jhb171achill said:

Superb concept, superb operational potential. Looking forward to this.

I wanna get a bit more prototypical with this, despite the vagueness. So probably going to have to pick your brain for some of the local goo/knowledge about specifics of this line and backdrop from time to time

This particular track plan which you uploaded/authored(delete as appropriate) many moons ago has always stuck with me as one of particular interest, Alas, the length has always made it super challenging to effectively build everything as i would have liked it to be. I think ive found a very effective balance here thats going to look super interesting when the board is more decorated up.

Edited July 14, 2022 by Sean

meathdane · July 14, 2022

Great work! Coming along very quick!

jhb171achill · July 14, 2022

Hi Sean, yes, keep the questions coming!

That was the original MGWR plan, but a further siding was added later, as shown dotted in this diagram. In the very last days, only the sidings each side of the right hand (ex-cattle) platform were in use, the line down to the harbour having been lifted the 2nd or 3rd time I saw it, c.1973/4.

Patrick Davey · July 14, 2022

Great progress!

Irishswissernie · July 14, 2022

A couple of (hopefully) inspiring views. 2 August 1967 & 1964. Looks like a portable grain or possibly beet loader on the first view.

jhb171achill · July 14, 2022

In that top (B&W) pic, the palvan seen on the left is at the end of the "new" siding shown on mjy diagram above as a dotted line. The van in the foreground is a GSR van. Note the water column, disused even then, in nthe distance on the right. Odd place for it, given that Westport station was less than 2km away.

I have lately found a definitive date for the final closure of this line to REGULAR goods trains. This was Monday 1st March 1943.

Thereafter, OCCASIONAL goods trains would operate on an "as-required" basis, and staff in the Quay station (which was fully staffed until then, I think with 2 people) were transferred eslewhere.

In the second pic, the very low height of the platform will be noted. The station building was an odd design, more like a small country cottage than railway architecture. Single storey on the platform side, 2-storey on the other side. A very unique and interesting type of prototype for a model.

jhb171achill · July 14, 2022

Have a look at this........... https://webapps.geohive.ie/mapviewer/index.html

Irishswissernie · July 15, 2022

This Album on Youtube has some interesting photos of the Station buildings etc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzuuAzTAcB4

jhb171achill · July 15, 2022

4 hours ago, Irishswissernie said:

This Album on Youtube has some interesting photos of the Station buildings etc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzuuAzTAcB4

Those pics of Gerry’s are probably the single best collection of photos of that short, scenic and very interesting line.

David Holman · July 16, 2022

Lessons for us all on certain types of track, especially colours of rail, sleepers, ballast and so on.

Sean · July 16, 2022

On 14/7/2022 at 12:03 PM, jhb171achill said:

Hi Sean, yes, keep the questions coming!

That was the original MGWR plan, but a further siding was added later, as shown dotted in this diagram. In the very last days, only the sidings each side of the right hand (ex-cattle) platform were in use, the line down to the harbour having been lifted the 2nd or 3rd time I saw it, c.1973/4.

Ah so heres where we deviate from history. The line up to the goods shed never existed however the dock line remained in use for regular "dock stuff" right up until 1977 and seen regular loading right up until the very end.

Going along with the "backwater" or auxiliary line description, I have more 121 class's now than any other loco and to be honest i actually quite like how they look running bonnet forward (attracting me to the earlier liveries in the periods which i do not normally model), so going with the concept that there is a turntable at a main station 2 or 3 miles away it gives me a nice precedent for bonnet forward running, ala barrack street.

On 14/7/2022 at 8:43 PM, jhb171achill said:

In that top (B&W) pic, the palvan seen on the left is at the end of the "new" siding shown on mjy diagram above as a dotted line. The van in the foreground is a GSR van. Note the water column, disused even then, in nthe distance on the right. Odd place for it, given that Westport station was less than 2km away.

I have lately found a definitive date for the final closure of this line to REGULAR goods trains. This was Monday 1st March 1943.

Thereafter, OCCASIONAL goods trains would operate on an "as-required" basis, and staff in the Quay station (which was fully staffed until then, I think with 2 people) were transferred eslewhere.

In the second pic, the very low height of the platform will be noted. The station building was an odd design, more like a small country cottage than railway architecture. Single storey on the platform side, 2-storey on the other side. A very unique and interesting type of prototype for a model.

Occasional goods works very well as it also means the required rolling stock can chop and change "as needed"

the little goods barn thing is not at all dissimilar to those DWWR station houses that are being discussed on the other thread.

On 15/7/2022 at 1:48 PM, jhb171achill said:

Those pics of Gerry’s are probably the single best collection of photos of that short, scenic and very interesting line.

Agreed. Had no idea this set of photos existed and it fills ina lot of gaps re scenery and the station "house" which has me rethinking some things i had initially set out for such as the abandoned platform, I could easily put a little abandoned shack on it and the oddly positioned watering point seems like a no brainer to put in somewhere.

On 14/7/2022 at 9:06 PM, jhb171achill said:

Have a look at this........... https://webapps.geohive.ie/mapviewer/index.html

a favourite of mine for planning old lines. and of course it raises another question. did the dock line always stop right where it does on the 25 inch map here or would it have ever continued on further down the quay? handiliy one of the buildings i am waiting to print is actually a little weighbridge shack that should go in nicely just over the road on the dock module.

are there any more photographs of the railway infrastructure on the quay, or even the quay itself to see what sort of buildings were on it and what sort of brickworks would have been used back in the day to build it.

15 hours ago, David Holman said:

Lessons for us all on certain types of track, especially colours of rail, sleepers, ballast and so on.

Agreed, and it goes back to what i was saying on the other thread. the gauge seems a lot wider in this than in a lot of videos, but also the sleeper density, there are a LOT of sleepers down under this track and that kinda makes me think neither bullhead nor code 75 would actually look "right" if used to model this line but in the same regard that it could be argued that code 100 does not really look "right" at all unless its got an american loco running over it.

why is there essentially no ballast and a heap of grass on the tracks in places? looks very cool but maybe a challenge to model.

Edited July 16, 2022 by Sean

Sean · July 16, 2022

A small but significant job has been carried out today.

My most recent build had been wracked with derailments pretty much anywhere the track crossed from one base board to another. So I am very conscious of it this time around.

So I salvaged these dowels from an old kitchen table and went about adding them to the dock

They are basically the exact same as the DCC concepts product. But without the price tag.

Unfortunately this has highlighted some of my raggedy carpentry skills as clearly the panel for the station baseboard has not been cut perfectly straight . Not a huge worry as I have plans to partially rebuild the middle board, for the moment my main concern is that the trackwork joins up accurately every time. And without fishplates, which if does.

It's only a small panel anyway, which I can easily replace, or I could open up the gap a bit and stick in a stream. Although that may get messy

As stated in the first post, I have been rushing to get this part done quickly as once I get the track laid down to the dock I want to again remove this module and work on it as a standalone piece. I want to build it up to as close to exhibition standard as I can get it. This is due to it being a living room piece but also as future practice for any exhibition layouts that I might decide to build.

I won't be holding the station module to as such a high standard as this will be more so a place to play trains, eventually it will get the full works treatment also though but I'm thinking longer term there.

GSR 800 · July 16, 2022

9 minutes ago, Sean said:

why is there essentially no ballast and a heap of grass on the tracks in places? looks very cool but maybe a challenge to model.

Time and neglect.

Long time since the ballast or weedsprayer went as far as the sidings.

The ballast is there, its just quite fine or ground down with time, for lack of a better term, mixed in with dirt, grime, soil and all kinds of other shite

jhb171achill · July 16, 2022

1 hour ago, Sean said:

did the dock line always stop right where it does on the 25 inch map here or would it have ever continued on further down the quay? handiliy one of the buildings i am waiting to print is actually a little weighbridge shack that should go in nicely just over the road on the dock module.

are there any more photographs of the railway infrastructure on the quay, or even the quay itself to see what sort of buildings were on it and what sort of brickworks would have been used back in the day to build it.

The dock line did, at one stage, go right out to the end of the quay where there were at least two sidings into two different mills. One., at least, was very short-lived. Both were gone by the 1950s, I'd say. The first time I thoroughly explored the site - and minus any camera - in the 70s (fifty years ago this summer!), I saw no trace of them at all, and even the extension across the road TOWARDS the quay had recently been lifted.

I started research for the Achill book in the late 1980s. From that day to this, I am unaware of a single photograph of the actual quay sidings anywhere - and I've looked hard!

Sean · July 17, 2022

some non railway shots to add reference points

hard to see any evidence of a railway today except for what we know from geohive. would those old buildings in the foreground possibly be the mills you are referring to?

on important point that has been annoying me, i see no evidence of cobblestones really at all. where there ever any?

call me lazy but if i could get away with the dock being on hard standing it would make me a happy chappy indeed lol.

shame this part of it has been forever lost to time. although ive been amazed by what we have found so far and who knows what will appear going foward.

46 minutes ago, jhb171achill said:

One. at least, was very short-lived. Both were gone by the 1950s, I'd say.

hmmm maybe if i look at some of the older maps and squint really hard it will come slapping me in the face

Edited July 17, 2022 by Sean

Sean · July 17, 2022

found it, and now im very intrigued, was the clew heritage centre an ex railway building by any chance?

i get the impression that the line may have ran paralell to the road road behind the wall where all the yachts are parked out of water. it then curves in behind or infront of the clew center(good store on 25 inch i THINK) with the point into the 2 seperate sites just beyond that. not sure though. its squinty work reading all these old maps and comparing to modern imagery. I think i have given myself way more geographic references than i need now given how small the layout actually is.

whats the story with the really low sea levels also? it seems to be down on some maps but not others, making things ever harder to trace than they should be.

Edited July 17, 2022 by Sean

David Holman · July 17, 2022

A couple of thoughts.

As your baseboards line up nicely, if you want to avoid the earthquake crack between them, use car body filler. Put clingfilm on one face, liberally smear the filler on the other and clamp firmly together. Once the filler has set, you should have a nice, almost invisible join, though if the boards are going to be permanently joined, you can fill over it anyway.

As for the quayside surface, am guessing you are aiming for something post 1960s and if so any setts, cobbles etch would probably have been main be covered in tarmac or concrete, so a lot less work to model.

Sean · July 17, 2022

Excellent, im going for 1970's but passable as 60's by changing out the cars and rolling stock.

the dockside module feels like its gonna be a real "layout in a day" piece as learning to cobble was going to be a big annoyance for me but for standing i have everything in stock and ready to go, and its one of the first things to be done!

to tidy up the massive crack ive taken that panel off and as soon as everyone is awake ill just give it a shave again with the chop saw to bring it back to a square edge and ill offer it back up with the square edge facing the baseboard join and screw into place, that will close it but creates a mid baseboard crack then but as you say it is easily remedied with filler. As usual ive just built the baseboards from crap left around the place, this time an ikea cd holder unit that fell apart and the boards just happened to be the perfect width, whilst free it does create the work of a lot of filling in the little holes and chips around it. so that is to say I was going to have to go heavy on the filler one way or another anyway and its no real extra work!

Sean · July 18, 2022

Quick progress on this one!

Sean · July 18, 2022

Super productive day today. Despite almost melting. Being able to work on this piece outside helps a lot.

Road paved and I'm rather happy with the outcome.

Half the water work is done. Not as green as I was going for but as this took a few attempts as is. Will look nice once finished tomorrow.

Ballasted the very short bit of ballasting that needs doing with n scale ballast.i wanted to make it a bit darker but I wanted to avoid that new ballast look so these small grains are the solution for now. Tried to leave a little green verge beside the track bed as in the prototype.

And stone walling everywhere. Wouldn't be mayo without it.

142 awaiting the mgwr ish gate.

Sher I can't lift this yoke are you sure it's the right wagon?!

142 returns with its wagon.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Sean

Sean · July 20, 2022

A well earned day off today.

Tonight i am contemplating the feasability of an additional module the what i could potentially make it look like.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Sean

Sean · July 20, 2022

Some time later.

Guess I need to build another baseboard for the other side now.

First radius curve but shouldn't cause too much heartache with my chosen rolling stock.

This should let me tease out the narrative a bit more and add to my scenic skills..

I'm really enjoying the pace of taking out a section and doing a lot of scenics in a small space at once.

Sean · July 21, 2022

On 17/7/2022 at 12:58 AM, jhb171achill said:

The dock line did, at one stage, go right out to the end of the quay where there were at least two sidings into two different mills. One., at least, was very short-lived. Both were gone by the 1950s, I'd say. The first time I thoroughly explored the site - and minus any camera - in the 70s (fifty years ago this summer!), I saw no trace of them at all, and even the extension across the road TOWARDS the quay had recently been lifted.

I started research for the Achill book in the late 1980s. From that day to this, I am unaware of a single photograph of the actual quay sidings anywhere - and I've looked hard!

had a bit of a trawl tonight as im still trying to work out the track alignment, the fact that the shoreline has changed over the years makes it a little confusing but i think i got it worked out now. you are right in saying that photos of the docks are few and far between, however I have come accross some at least that might help work things out a little more.

some vans at the mill

Where "the towers" is now

.

A Classes with oil and 20 footers! quay line is gone.

unseen station angle

interesting video of the harbour. no railways but you can see a large corrugated building that i can only assume is the goods store(now gone)

edit: few more here.

Quay sketch circa 1970

SS Kelpie moored at Westport Quay and taking on a cargo of grain from Pollexfens Mill.

Lawrence Collection - NLI

The Quay Westport over 1 hundred years Ago, notice the second set of gates for the siding. Also note the goods railway wagon at the bow of the ship.

The harbour at westport quay 1900 is the caption on this one but given theres no mill its earlier?.

Edited July 21, 2022 by Sean

Sean · July 21, 2022

This one is estimated 1970's (around my time) good to note a lack of cobblestones which will make my life far easier. Apparently this ship was built in 1957 for general cargo and carried in coal and timber. It was renamed in 1986.

So with tonights digging it seems that even in the later days of this harbour it was still accommodating big ships as well as just being a small fishing harbour which greatly increases what i can do here.

as well as box vans and cattle vans we will also see coal and ranks grain hoppers. alongside a few other misc pieces of traffic that would have moved by sea and rail

Where i am going to deviate from prototype is simple ; instead of being lifted in the 70's the line remained for another 20 years as a goods only line right onto the quay. I am not going to specify train frequency as im sure this will change as much as my mood and the operating era does. it can alll be operated by a single engine and even in the latter days it was almost unheard of to have a second engine on the line although it did happen from time to time. the station is completeley disused except for the goods platforms and the very occasional railtour.

I want to set up an automated shuttle from the dock to the station for goods. a small platform is being considered for a railbus to run down to the docks also however I dont think that idea will make my final cut.

Edited July 21, 2022 by Sean

Mayner · July 21, 2022

6 hours ago, Sean said:

had a bit of a trawl tonight as im still trying to work out the track alignment, the fact that the shoreline has changed over the years makes it a little confusing but i think i got it worked out now. you are right in saying that photos of the docks are few and far between, however I have come accross some at least that might help work things out a little more.

some vans at the mill

A Classes with oil and 20 footers! quay line is gone.

SS Kelpie moored at Westport Quay and taking on a cargo of grain from Pollexfens Mill.

Lawrence Collection - NLI

The Quay Westport over 1 hundred years Ago, notice the second set of gates for the siding. Also note the goods railway wagon at the bow of the ship.

The harbour at westport quay 1900 is the caption on this one but given theres no mill its earlier?.

Some interesting photos.

My family stayed for a week in the Roman Island caravan park on our summer holidays in 1975, Unlike JHB I didn't get to explore the railway or goods yard commercial shipping had ceased and the gates to the port entrance & the grain elevator locked

The Limerick Steamship Company had a dilapidated wooden office/shed (not unlike the Dapol coal office https://www.petersspares.com/dapol-c011-hut-coal-office-water-crane-plastic-kit-oo-gauge.ir) at the Westport end of the Quay Road.

Poloxfen's Grain Elevator was likely to have been built during the early 1900s, the RH Hall Elevator on Dublin's North Wall was built between 1915-20. The industrial buildings and tall chimney in the background behind the elevator may be the mill and power plant.

Its possible bulk grain was loaded into MGWR convertible wagons through the roof and discharged through the side doors, American and Canadian Railroads carried grain in standard boxcars up to the widespread introduction of purpose built hopper wagons during the 1970s and 80s.

Its good to see the photo of 001 hauling a tank wagon and CIE containers on flat wagons, there is a an excellent colour photo possibly of the same train shunting at Westport Quay in an IRRS Journal published during the late 80s early 90s, worth checking out by visiting the IRRS Library if in Dublin.

The tank wagons were used for bringing in diesel to the CIE bus garage in the station yard, the 20' containers on 4w flat wagons were used as convention vans loaded/unloaded in the goods yard rather than for Lo-Lo collection and delivery

Mike 84C · July 21, 2022

Those are fantastic photos of the mill and quay area's. I know nothing of the Irish milling industry but spent 30+ yrs in the English milling industry. I think judging by the type of elevators shown the wagons will be bringing in product to be made into flour or cattle/animal feeds. I say this because behind the vans & against the mill wall is what looks like a short elevator known over here as a "bag" elevator and the sacks would have been emptied into a small hopper to feed it. The coaster is I believe being emptied by a vacuum evacuator or it could be an enclosed belt and cup elevator. I think maybe the latter, I cannot get enough magnification on my machine.

A descent shoo in for the building could be the Walther's Red Wing mill kit, its deffo the right style if a little small but that may work well on your layout.

Those white sacks in the MGWR convertibles look like 2-1/4cwt sacks thats 252 lbs or 18 stones per sack. Pretty fit old boys back in the day! If you want to metericate 2.2 lbs = 1 kg.

Sean · July 21, 2022

9 hours ago, Mayner said:

Some interesting photos.

My family stayed for a week in the Roman Island caravan park on our summer holidays in 1975, Unlike JHB I didn't get to explore the railway or goods yard commercial shipping had ceased and the gates to the port entrance & the grain elevator locked

The Limerick Steamship Company had a dilapidated wooden office/shed (not unlike the Dapol coal office https://www.petersspares.com/dapol-c011-hut-coal-office-water-crane-plastic-kit-oo-gauge.ir) at the Westport end of the Quay Road.

Poloxfen's Grain Elevator was likely to have been built during the early 1900s, the RH Hall Elevator on Dublin's North Wall was built between 1915-20. The industrial buildings and tall chimney in the background behind the elevator may be the mill and power plant.

Its possible bulk grain was loaded into MGWR convertible wagons through the roof and discharged through the side doors, American and Canadian Railroads carried grain in standard boxcars up to the widespread introduction of purpose built hopper wagons during the 1970s and 80s.

Its good to see the photo of 001 hauling a tank wagon and CIE containers on flat wagons, there is a an excellent colour photo possibly of the same train shunting at Westport Quay in an IRRS Journal published during the late 80s early 90s, worth checking out by visiting the IRRS Library if in Dublin.

The tank wagons were used for bringing in diesel to the CIE bus garage in the station yard, the 20' containers on 4w flat wagons were used as convention vans loaded/unloaded in the goods yard rather than for Lo-Lo collection and delivery