Fry Model Railway

[Colin R]

I genuinely feel sorry for you guys and this layout this is no way to treat a national treasure.

Short of suggesting the setting up of a new heritage center somewhere in Eire where it would be appreciated and possibly in an old station as well I don't know what else to suggest.

The other thing to make something happen would be to get a few of you to see if you can somehow become Trustees of the group which now owns the layout at that level you can try and make the decision to find a new site for the layout. I am not sure just how big you need the building, but a layout like this needs to be displayed properly.

 

Colin

 

 

[jhb171achill]

Unfortunately, to these people it's just a "toy train". As Eoin says, they don't know what they have.

 

[Sven-E]

Drove past Malahide Casio today. Since last time I was there they have put up a nice sign saying "Coming soon".

[Tarabuses]

Soon, yes a lovely word that can mean so much (or nothing).

Edited April 29, 2018 by Tarabuses

[steventrain]

Fry Model railway Facebook.

'Update on Fry Model Railway & Casino Project, Malahide
Tenders were received in late January for the refurbishment and extension of the Casino cottage building to allow for use as a new home for the Fry Model Railway collection. Following a clarification process the tender assessment has been concluded and subject to final checks a tender report and recommendation to appoint a contractor is imminent. Based on tendering procedures it is now likely that a contractor will start on site in mid-April 2018. The works are contracted to last 44 weeks finishing on site mid-February 2019.

The tender assessment has been completed and a letter of intent has issued in relation to the design and construction of the Fry Model Railway exhibition. The proposal includes a large working model train display as a central element in the main exhibition space.

We are very pleased that work should be starting shortly as the condition of the property is gradually deteriorating.'

[Tarabuses]

It seems that work is beginning at the Casino cottage.

Edited May 11, 2018 by Tarabuses

[Noel]

Interesting. Does anybody know if it will be limited to a static display of the Fry collection or if there will also be an operational layout running the layout stock that was at Malahide castle?

[murrayec]

45 minutes ago, Noel said:

Interesting. Does anybody know if it will be limited to a static display of the Fry collection or if there will also be an operational layout running the layout stock that was at Malahide castle?

 

See here Noel

 

The layout stock that ran in the Castle was more Mr Tadhg's than Fry, the majority of the Fry models were in the display cases and storage- some of his diesels ran on the layout until they wore out the WM wheels.....

Eoin

 

[jhb171achill]

About time.

In my opinion, the actual Fry models ought to be displayed; they are too valuable and unique to wear out. Detailed photos of the innards and home-made mechanisms which power them would be of interest. In this day and age, more modern state-of-the-art models by Murphy, Provincial, SSM, IRM and the other manufacturers here would make a better operational display.

For readers of this website, no introductions are necessary, but in all reality the regulars here would collectively do a better job than anyone else at assembling a working layout, starting with baseboards and ending up with high-end scenery. The opportunities are there. Using kits alone, the NCC, GNR, and CIE / GSR areas and eras from 1930s onwards would be easy to replicate, in so mnay cases just with RTR off-the-shelf models.

Perhaps a consortium of kindred folks here might open discussions with whoever is putting this all together?

[murrayec]

Hi JHB

Some time back myself and Mr Tierney- refer back in this thread, made representation to the Minister, the custodians, the local authority and the friends of the Fry Model- all to no avail. In my submission in the planning process I again offered assistance- I reckon what happened in the past has made the custodians vary guarded and they feel we just want to take away their goodies!

With the limited size of the proposed facility I reckon the complete Fry Collection just will not fit. The hall for a Gauge 0 layout is restrictive in size, so as you say a Gauge 00 layout would seem more appropriate, of course there could be a O track incorporated to allow Fry Models run on special occasions- maybe!

This would be sad and disappointing, but for the patrons that visit the new facility- they would not know the difference!

Eoin

[jhb171achill]

Now that you mention it, Eoin, I remember you mentioning that. A terrible shame, as you say.

Maybe an outsider recommending your services and wares.........?

[Noel]

Indeed a shame.  To attract footfall it will really need a fairly impressive operating layout of some kind, with lots of action especially targeted at tourists, children and families rather than just modellers.  Yes the O gauge layout in the castle was more a very big colourful 'train set' lacking authenticity, but it had enough visual stimulus to make 10yo boys faint with excitement. Static displays alone will not generate footfall. I do hope they can build and more importantly operate a visually stimulating layout with lots of movement, noises and lights, ships and planes also.

[murrayec]

It is very disappointing to hear the announcement that the running model will now be in Gauge OO scale, it was inevitable I suppose with the way the County Council design team ignored the scale of the Fry Layout and chose a facility & extension not compatible with what would be required.

A large Gauge OO layout will be a delight to have but will in no way personify, compare or pay homage to the Fry Layout. This may not matter to the general public, but in my opinion, and others, dilutes and seriously diminishes the impact and essence of what the Fry Model is, or from now on- used to be.

There is a belief on the part of the design team that the Gauge O models cannot be restored to running condition (the original Fry Models are restricted from running) or new stock prepared on the basis of the cost- 1.5 million Euro was left by Mr Gaffney, which is now probably over 2 million Euro on deposit, for the restoration of the Fry Model and housing the exhibit in the Casino, of which the majority of this money the Council has decided is going on the building and interior display systems and a very small proportion of the bequeath is going on conservation of the models and the building of the Gauge OO layout.

In my opinion this is wrong and has come about because of the lack of understanding of what the Fry Model is, it's scale, and the fact that there was no 'Qualified' person on the design team to represent the Fry Model and to promote the restoration of the models and keep the running layout at Gauge O scale. Also ensuring an adequate proportion of the funds went towards the exhibits restoration and additions in the future.

I have not seen the interior design for this project, but on reviewing previous work the appointed interior design company has done- it's minimalistic, with very modern feel, a design company that will spend far more money on interior finishes, display cabinets and display systems than the Council has decided to spend on the actual exhibits.

There is also additional money being put into the building project by the Council on behalf of the Irish people!

I made several attempts to offer assistance to the Action Team for the Fry Model, and to the County Council, but my assistance was flatly refused and ignored. I did make submission during the planning process and was successful in having a few alterations done to the design- but the main point of 'Scale' was ignored.

An opportunity lost, it could have been so much better, though it would have required a larger budget and a lot more visionary thinking and planning on the part of the design team to achieve it.

It is great to see the project proceed, although in diminished form.

 

Eoin

[minister_for_hardship]

Disappointed, but not surprised, unenlightened Ireland being what it is. One train set (sic.) is as good as the next it seems. 

From the post above it looks like it's going to be a new fangled "Interpretive Centre" rather than the Fry Model Railway we knew.

Edited December 7, 2018 by minister_for_hardship

[jhb171achill]

Unfortunately, Minister, that's exactly what it is going to be. I've seen bits of the plans and have spoken to several,of the design team, and thus I regretfully concur with all murrayec's comments.

It will give a little history of the town, the castle estate (who once owned the. Casino house), Fry himself, a minimalistic bit of railway history, and the models. And it'll have a train set! Woohoo!

For the likes of us here, worth looking at, but that's about it.  For the kiddies wanting to see Thomas, an afternoon out.

Long term financial viability.........dunno?

[jhb171achill]

Fry had a large collection of railway artefacts as well as his models. His models ran into the hundreds. All are in varying condition.

The artefact list is currently being perused to see what bits are of the highest historical interest for display.

I understand that all concerned may be meeting again very soon to evaluate progress.

[murrayec]

51 minutes ago, jhb171achill said:

Fry had a large collection of railway artefacts as well as his models. His models ran into the hundreds. All are in varying condition.

The artefact list is currently being perused to see what bits are of the highest historical interest for display.

Yes, and again sadly the proposed facility will display a very small part of the overall collection. Fry also had a monster loco in the 5 or 7.25inch gauge scale! it now resides in the tourist office on Suffolk Street- that should have been included in the plan!!

Eoin

[Horsetan]

3 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

Fry had a large collection of railway artefacts as well as his models. His models ran into the hundreds. All are in varying condition.

The artefact list is currently being perused to see what bits are of the highest historical interest for display....

Presumably the rest will be deemed surplus to requirements and flogged to the highest bidder?

[jhb171achill]

I sincerely hope not, but little surprises me these days.....

[Colin R]

Dare i say would it be worth thinking in terms of setting up something like the UK Pendon style project between all Irish model/ heritage railway fans, it won't be cheap but if a fund could be started that if any of this collection came up for sale funds would be in place to purchase them, where you would then display and store them well that is another matter to consider.

Colin.

 

[murrayec]

2 hours ago, Horsetan said:

Presumably the rest will be deemed surplus to requirements and flogged to the highest bidder?

The Fry models cannot be sold off, Fingal Co Co are the custodians but the collection belongs to the Irish People. I would say that the models fit for display will be used in the new facility, the un-fit will be held in storage, possibly never to be seen again unless the Council decide to put more money in to restore them for display!!

17 minutes ago, Colin R said:

Dare i say would it be worth thinking in terms of setting up something like the UK Pendon style project between all Irish model/ heritage railway fans, it won't be cheap but if a fund could be started that if any of this collection came up for sale funds would be in place to purchase them, where you would then display and store them well that is another matter to consider.

Colin.

 

Hi Colin

A fantastic idea, one that I had many discussions about,  but alas, if you take the current situation on the Fry Models;-

A number of years ago in discussion with 'Irish model/ heritage railway fans' and on this thread- if you look back, we asked them to lend support on the Fry Model Cause, of which many said they would get involved. But in the end very little support was given and at the time when we had public comment during the planning process only one 'Irish model/ heritage railway fans' took the time to do so.

On that basis I feel your idea would not have enough support in this country! sadly Ireland's Pendon will have to be at the Casino in Malahide- for now!......

Eoin

 

[Colin R]

Thanks for the reply Eoin I will just have to keep bashing away at the Euro lottery in that case. I guess for now Ireland is not yet ready for such a model center.

I would be more concerned for those items which get stored, as I have know items to just disappear without trace unless some sort of independent audit take place once a year. 

Colin

 

Edited December 13, 2018 by Colin R

[murrayec]

19 hours ago, Colin R said:

I would be more concerned for those items which get stored, as I have know items to just disappear without trace unless some sort of independent audit take place once a year.

Well at the moment they are in pretty safe and secure hands, better than they have been in the past 5 or 6 years!  The Council do plan to conserve the models and re-storage them correctly which was included for in the Museum Exhibit Tender, whether they carry out this work is another question.....

Eoin

[murrayec]

The Fry Museum opening is getting closer.

See the link below, a press release on the Co Co's website shows the official opening of the restored Casino House 2 days ago;-

http://www.fingalcoco.ie/media/PRESS RELEASE Refurbishment work on Malahide Casino nearing completion.pdf

Trains to follow soon.

Eoin

 

[DiveController]

 

[jhb171achill]

CASINO MUSEUM & FRY COLLECTION UPDATE

Now that the Casino Museum is open, up and running, some final tweaks still need to be made. A little tweaking of the interactive displays will be made over the coming weeks and months, and attention is now being turned to the future os redundant material from the erstwhile "Castle" layout. Remember, the layout in the castle was NOT Fry's, nor were the locos and rolling stock which ran on it.

A full evaluation of this very considerable amount of material is being conducted over the coming weeks, in particular what if anything can be done with the huge amount of stored pieces of the castle layout.

Anyone got a heated attic about 55 x 30 feet, upon which a very considerable weight (many tons) can be placed?!!

Within the Casino, visitor numbers are healthily increasing and it is my hope that some of Fry's British or mainland European models may be able to be displayed. Currently, there's no room other than one small display case.

[DART8118]

On 2/27/2020 at 11:44 PM, jhb171achill said:

CASINO MUSEUM & FRY COLLECTION UPDATE

Anyone got a heated attic about 55 x 30 feet, upon which a very considerable weight (many tons) can be placed?!!

 

Did Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown express interest when the layout had to move from Malahide Castle?

[jhb171achill]

Not to my knowledge, DART8118, but I will be speaking next week to one who will know!

I should also be speaking to Fry’s daughter, an absolutely lovely lady. She has followed all developments since C L Fry died in 1972, and she can tell you absolute chapter and verse of all moves; some of which had her support, and others she was not happy about back in the day.

A book about Fry and his achievements is under way. I am very anxious to ensure that she thoroughly endorses every syllable in it! 

I will see what I can find out about DLR Council. 

[jhb171achill]

One of the old visitor books from Churchtown.

Railway company personnel crop up now and again.....

And some signals from the “castle” layout.

[murrayec]

2 hours ago, Midland Man said:

I thought If you put a O gauge American styled layout That you follows you around would work space wise

Now your talking, that's exactly what should have been done! The design of the museum was done completely separate and isolated from any model layout design! the design team only got in a consultant on the model railway layout after the building & the interior was designed- that's why there is not enough space??

Eoin

[Midland Man]

Another thing that disipointed me was that the trains did not stop at the malahide or mallow model.Simple things like that improve the model for younger people get the imagination going.

Edited April 6, 2020 by Midland Man

[murrayec]

Yes, I heard similar from two ex councillors that went to see the museum, they said 'delighted to see the Fry Models back out on view' and  'that the layout was pretty good but after watching two trains go round n round it just got boring' they also told me that they would not go back.....

Hopefully over time as the layout gets more complete their may be a more interactivity?

Eoin

[Midland Man]

100% right 

Basebord Dave did a excellent model with bray head and the Dublin scenes being my favorite scenes out of it.My brother who is a military model thought it was on of those Noch kits but it he was wrong. The scratch building is amazing with Malahide station being my favorite.

[jhb171achill]

1 hour ago, murrayec said:

Now your talking, that's exactly what should have been done! The design of the museum was done completely separate and isolated from any model layout design! the design team only got in a consultant on the model railway layout after the building & the interior was designed- that's why there is not enough space??

Eoin

This is EXACTLY the issue.

The reality now is that there's a building, up and paid for, which as Eoin says, isn't big enough to take any sort of decent 0 gauge set-up, let along anything remotely like what was in the castle. The Fry models were always going to go back in glass cases - but many, many people THINK that what they saw running in the castle WERE the Fry models - they were not, as Fry decreed in his will that his own were never to run again. What ran in the castle were models made by seven (identified so at) or possibly more, model-makers. 

So, building-wise, it is what it is, and we just need to make the best of it and enhance the entire experience as best we can.

In the castle, SOME of Fry's models were in glass cases. In the new place, at least ALL of his Irish stuff is, and once more display cabinets arrive, it will be possible to display his British, American and Mainland European stuff too, either in rotation or with representative samples being exhibited.

All there was ever going to room for is the 00 gauge layout, made by one of our colleagues here.

Over the next while, once Internment is over. the whole display of the non-model artefacts will be re-done, as stuff was just stuck on walls to get the place open. The whole issue of Fry's actual photo collection will be another matter, along with correct display, labelling and so on, of railway crests, signs, nameplates and so on. There is a lot of work yet to be done - a huge lot.

A selection of the 0 gauge models which ran in the castle will eventually operate on the raised track.

Edited April 6, 2020 by jhb171achill

[Colin R]

Please excuse the question, but just how big would you need a building to be to do a proper job? To display and run an O gauge layout.

Regards

Colin R