IRM Latest! All Aboard The Enterprise And Matching Hunslets!

[Ironroad]

2 hours ago, leslie10646 said:

My dear @Mayner - read my post above (which involved a half hour's research - I TOLD YOU WHICH SETS THERE!!!!!!

I never actually the Avocet, but it was indeed a pretty iconic piece of kit. I remember Modern Railways reported how it just took off up Shap with a heavy test train.

One of the advantages of being middle aged before you lot were born is that this stuff was just part of the scene.

Has someone mentioned that they were used on the Cobh branch as well - again see reference in my earlier post. 

Hi Leslie, thank you, I don't think I'm too far behind you and wondered if my memory was playing tricks on me and gladly it wasn't.   I remember travelling to Bray & Greystones on steam trains, to Belfast behind a Jeep. I also remember travelling in the first class compartment of an AEC Railcar where the drivers compartment was separated by a glass partition (the upholstery was green) and you had the drivers view of the route. Of course ultimately the daily drudge of commuting becomes a blur but it is impossible to forget the AEC Railcars in their final spartan state pushed and pulled by C class locos. While the class 80 on the other hand was really peripheral in the scheme of things south of the border. 

[jhb171achill]

3 hours ago, leslie10646 said:

One of the advantages of being middle aged before you lot were born is that this stuff was just part of the scene.

Tis true; I may not be quite the Provincial age, but I’m on the road - and I clearly remember things back to about 1960…..

STEAM things, principally…..

[Colin_McLeod]

15 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

IRRSuavem striketh backeth 

 Jonathan. Wee Willie McCormack and Baldy Maunsell would not be impressed.

 

Societas Hibernica actorum ferriviariorum referit.

Edited January 25 by Colin_McLeod

[leslie10646]

3 hours ago, Ironroad said:

Hi Leslie, thank you, I don't think I'm too far behind you and wondered if my memory was playing tricks on me and gladly it wasn't.   I remember travelling to Bray & Greystones on steam trains, to Belfast behind a Jeep. I also remember travelling in the first class compartment of an AEC Railcar where the drivers compartment was separated by a glass partition (the upholstery was green) and you had the drivers view of the route. Of course ultimately the daily drudge of commuting becomes a blur but it is impossible to forget the AEC Railcars in their final spartan state pushed and pulled by C class locos. While the class 80 on the other hand was really peripheral in the scheme of things south of the border. 

Hi @Ironroad. You poor man having to commute on "The Push Pull"!

BUT, you have to salute the management of CIE that they gave you these things as "trains" complete with their kitchen chairs!

The management said to themselves "In no time at all, the passengers will be writing to their TDs saying "have you seen what we have to travel in?"

"Then we get what we want, an electric commuter railway - The DART!

Guess what, it happened!

[Warbonnet]

On 24/1/2026 at 3:11 PM, Ironroad said:

Hi John, I bow to your superior knowledge on railway operations in Ireland, however you state that the 80 class operated on the Howth to Bray service. I travelled daily between Howth Junction and later from Harmonstown to Tara St from 1981 to 1991 and never saw an 80 on that service or travelled in one. But I do remember seeing them at platform 7 in Connolly on the Maynooth service but that was for a very very short period of time.

To be fair you are not comparing apples to apples

Hi @Ironroad,

Just wondering why you think it's not an "apples to apples" comparison?

On the wider topic....

There is an inconvenient truth in all this; there is another manufacturer of Irish outline, one who does not comment publicly (and I can appreciate and understand why), and his most recent release (granted a rerun) is still very freely available. I talked to one trader and he told me that "I still have heaps of them, they're not moving".

These locos are of course right in the "sweet spot" of what many would consider to be the prime market for Irish outline, Ready-to-run models. They have sold at a premium for years on EBay and the likes. You cannot have a layout from 1962 to 2009 anywhere in the country without them. 

The same company had other, larger locos, sitting on shelves for years. I remember one day, said man nearly kissed me when he paid us a visit in our first premises in Crumlin, thanking us for producing all the wagons which sold out his locos in the shops. Again, the big ticket diesel locos we all love and know, and now want more of. Maybe the last rerun has given pause for thought about these reruns and their viability as the market has slowed for him too?

So, with that evidence, I have to say I refute the "you made the wrong thing" charge. I do think it's a market issue in itself. However, I don't apportion blame on anyone, and indeed thank every single one of you who has supported us in the past, does so now, and will do in the future. It's just how the market is right now. That's life. 

IRM has been since day one, an open and "chatty" manufacturer, born out of the spirit of this forum, and therefore, a feeling of "we're all in this together". I was merely mentioning aloud how the current market feels, and what peoples thoughts are on it. There has been some really good, interesting feedback and thought, and I must say I credit many of the contributions on here having a firm knowledge of the industry, even though you are not working in it every day. It's impressive. We really didnt want the model pile up of 3-4 big ticket items coming in one year, but we are where we are, and sometimes things just go that way. 

It certainly was not some sort of "emotional blackmail" to buy stuff you don't want, as was mentioned in some quarters. To be honest I found such reactions really disappointing, and surprising. Perhaps we should not be as open and as chatty as before about the industry and "this side of the fence" going forwards for not wanting to cause offence in the future, and inadvertently place unrealistic expectations on any of our fans or customers. I guess I myself have learnt a lesson there. 

Anyway, thank you to everyone, we always appreciate the support, and look forward to bringing you seriously impressive models you will love in the future, both near and longer term.

Cheers!

Fran 

[Mol_PMB]

Fran,

Many thanks for the open and detailed message which certainly helps us understand the position. 

My apologies if some of my earlier comments were unhelpful - on occasion I was getting a feeling of ‘buy this product you don’t want, or we’ll never produce the one you do want’.

Perhaps I’m in a minority on this forum in recently returning to Irish modelling, and having missed the opportunity to buy some of these models first time round I now welcome the reruns and the secondhand market. I suppose the way to grow the market is with more people like me who haven’t already bought too much.

For what it’s worth, with a bit of patience I have been able to pick up almost all the older models I was looking for on the secondhand market, although often at a slightly premium price. Cement bubbles and the 141s from the other supplier you mention were an exception and the reruns there were much appreciated by me and I’ve bought several of each.

I would definitely support new releases with the C class being my highest priority.

Please keep communicating. It really does help. Sometimes when it all goes quiet we get worried. 
Cheers,

Mol

[jhb171achill]

Likewise, I always appreciate the communication channels here from IRM. To those of us (virtually 100%) who are NOT in the business of making Irish models for sale, either in RTR or kit form or whatever, it provides a good insight into the difficulties faced by what inevitably, when we think of it, is a tiny, tiny, tiny market within a very much minority niche of a minority hobby.

I think I can say on behalf o all of us on this forum we are very grateful for what we have and we look forward to future issues, whatever and whenever they may be.

 

[Ironroad]

On 26/1/2026 at 3:40 PM, Warbonnet said:

Hi @Ironroad,

Just wondering why you think it's not an "apples to apples" comparison?

On the wider topic....

There is an inconvenient truth in all this; there is another manufacturer of Irish outline, one who does not comment publicly (and I can appreciate and understand why), and his most recent release (granted a rerun) is still very freely available. I talked to one trader and he told me that "I still have heaps of them, they're not moving".

These locos are of course right in the "sweet spot" of what many would consider to be the prime market for Irish outline, Ready-to-run models. They have sold at a premium for years on EBay and the likes. You cannot have a layout from 1962 to 2009 anywhere in the country without them. 

The same company had other, larger locos, sitting on shelves for years. I remember one day, said man nearly kissed me when he paid us a visit in our first premises in Crumlin, thanking us for producing all the wagons which sold out his locos in the shops. Again, the big ticket diesel locos we all love and know, and now want more of. Maybe the last rerun has given pause for thought about these reruns and their viability as the market has slowed for him too?

So, with that evidence, I have to say I refute the "you made the wrong thing" charge. I do think it's a market issue in itself. However, I don't apportion blame on anyone, and indeed thank every single one of you who has supported us in the past, does so now, and will do in the future. It's just how the market is right now. That's life. 

IRM has been since day one, an open and "chatty" manufacturer, born out of the spirit of this forum, and therefore, a feeling of "we're all in this together". I was merely mentioning aloud how the current market feels, and what peoples thoughts are on it. There has been some really good, interesting feedback and thought, and I must say I credit many of the contributions on here having a firm knowledge of the industry, even though you are not working in it every day. It's impressive. We really didnt want the model pile up of 3-4 big ticket items coming in one year, but we are where we are, and sometimes things just go that way. 

It certainly was not some sort of "emotional blackmail" to buy stuff you don't want, as was mentioned in some quarters. To be honest I found such reactions really disappointing, and surprising. Perhaps we should not be as open and as chatty as before about the industry and "this side of the fence" going forwards for not wanting to cause offence in the future, and inadvertently place unrealistic expectations on any of our fans or customers. I guess I myself have learnt a lesson there. 

Anyway, thank you to everyone, we always appreciate the support, and look forward to bringing you seriously impressive models you will love in the future, both near and longer term.

Cheers!

Fran 

Firstly, the apples to apples comment was a response to BosKonay’s posting “ The Class 89 is a class of 1 and has sold better than the A class” I don’t know how this separate posting got tagged onto my response to John. But regardless I don’t think the comparison is fair as considering the scale and diversity of the British market I would expect even a class of one such as this would outsell even the most common Irish class on the Irish market.

 

Beyond that, it is worth re reading your posting on Jan 21. The tone of this was quite dire and if I may I’ll quote a few extracts. 

“We can see a big slow down in purchases” 

“The sad reality is that there is likely to be less and less offerings in Irish outline as a result if the trend is a continuous one. “

“But if everyone is full up, then our output will likely severely restrict going forwards.”

“With the NIR stuff, if you want to see an 80 Class in the future, the decision to tool one is entirely dependent on the sales of the Hunslets and these coaches.”

So forgive me for reaching the conclusion that with all of the backlog coming to market this year clearing the decks), nothing on the agenda beyond this year, and the statements above, that we are at the end of the road. My reaction to this was to try and provide you with thoughts on what may be at the root of the slowdown in sales through the lens of a customer and while your colleague viewed this as “rude” I was somewhat heartened if not entirely reassured by some of the things you have said since.

As for the slow sales of the  rerun of the 141/181 class locos by another producer, it may be that while in the “sweetspot” this was overly ambitious in terms of the quantities produced. Many of us do purchase on the basis of as you put it “As we say, if it's what you want, grab it.” and I have 13 of these locos from the original run. 

I don’t think we are “full up”, I think the slowdown is more due to a few offerings that have limited interest, despite the beauty of the modelling.

I have appended a table to put this in perspective.

This is not intended to be a comprehensive listing; rather it is a list of items already offered or coming models, plus a mooted item and a couple of what I believe are highly desired items.

 

The number in class and length of time in service can usually be used as a measure of marketability.  So this list clearly demonstrates that there has been a very deliberate attempt to hit the “sweetspots” by that other producer and in general given the scarcity of these items they seem to have been successful launches. But by the same  measurements I was surprised by IRMs  announcements of the 800’s and the Hunslets. The 800 is iconic but a bit limited from a modeller's perspective (there was a lot of discussion on this forum as to what would be desirable) and I think collectors wishing to display them in glass cases are a bigger market. As for the Hunslets, they really only saw service for 10 years and were displaced in 1980 by the 111 class, a model of which was already available to haul the Mk 2 NIR liveried coaches you had already released.  Not to forget models of 201 class nos. 208 & 209 were also available. 

But despite seeing these offerings as very very limited, knowing they will be of a very high standard and in the spirit of my continuous support for you I ordered one 800 and two Hunslets, but compare that to the nine Class A locos I purchased.  I also have just a single 3 car ICR on order despite the fact that my period of interest is 1950 - 2000. Compare with an order for thirteen Park Royals.

Again looking at the list, it would seem there is a reasonable case for a Class 80 release, (much more so than the Hunslets). However, even if the Hunslets and Blue & Crimson Coaches sell, it might be a good idea to park that for the time being and attempt to kick start sales a bit with something like the AEC railcars, even a drip feed of these.  I would buy every version offered and at least six C Class locos.

As always you have my support and respect for what you do. Thank you Tom

Loco/Railcar	No. in Class	Service Period	Notes
Class 800	3	1939- 1962	Redundant after 1955
AEC Railcar	60 CIE, 20 GNRI	1950-1984	Last 8 years as Push Pulls
A Class	60	1955-1995
C Class	34	1956 - 1986	6 with NIR until 1997
121 Class	15	1961 - 2008
141 Class	37	1962 - 2010
181 Class	12	1966 - 2009
101 Class Hunslet	3	1970-1999	Limited use beyond 1980
80 Class (Thumpers)	22	1975-2011	3 sets leased by IR '87-'90
071 Class	18 IR, 3 NIR	1977 - Present
201 Class	32 IE, 2 NIR	1994- Present

 

[ttc0169]

1 hour ago, Ironroad said:

Firstly, the apples to apples comment was a response to BosKonay’s posting “ The Class 89 is a class of 1 and has sold better than the A class” I don’t know how this separate posting got tagged onto my response to John. But regardless I don’t think the comparison is fair as considering the scale and diversity of the British market I would expect even a class of one such as this would outsell even the most common Irish class on the Irish market.

 

Beyond that, it is worth re reading your posting on Jan 21. The tone of this was quite dire and if I may I’ll quote a few extracts. 

“We can see a big slow down in purchases” 

“The sad reality is that there is likely to be less and less offerings in Irish outline as a result if the trend is a continuous one. “

“But if everyone is full up, then our output will likely severely restrict going forwards.”

“With the NIR stuff, if you want to see an 80 Class in the future, the decision to tool one is entirely dependent on the sales of the Hunslets and these coaches.”

So forgive me for reaching the conclusion that with all of the backlog coming to market this year clearing the decks), nothing on the agenda beyond this year, and the statements above, that we are at the end of the road. My reaction to this was to try and provide you with thoughts on what may be at the root of the slowdown in sales through the lens of a customer and while your colleague viewed this as “rude” I was somewhat heartened if not entirely reassured by some of the things you have said since.

As for the slow sales of the  rerun of the 141/181 class locos by another producer, it may be that while in the “sweetspot” this was overly ambitious in terms of the quantities produced. Many of us do purchase on the basis of as you put it “As we say, if it's what you want, grab it.” and I have 13 of these locos from the original run. 

I don’t think we are “full up”, I think the slowdown is more due to a few offerings that have limited interest, despite the beauty of the modelling.

I have appended a table to put this in perspective.

This is not intended to be a comprehensive listing; rather it is a list of items already offered or coming models, plus a mooted item and a couple of what I believe are highly desired items.

 

The number in class and length of time in service can usually be used as a measure of marketability.  So this list clearly demonstrates that there has been a very deliberate attempt to hit the “sweetspots” by that other producer and in general given the scarcity of these items they seem to have been successful launches. But by the same  measurements I was surprised by IRMs  announcements of the 800’s and the Hunslets. The 800 is iconic but a bit limited from a modeller's perspective (there was a lot of discussion on this forum as to what would be desirable) and I think collectors wishing to display them in glass cases are a bigger market. As for the Hunslets, they really only saw service for 10 years and were displaced in 1980 by the 111 class, a model of which was already available to haul the Mk 2 NIR liveried coaches you had already released.  Not to forget models of 201 class nos. 208 & 209 were also available. 

But despite seeing these offerings as very very limited, knowing they will be of a very high standard and in the spirit of my continuous support for you I ordered one 800 and two Hunslets, but compare that to the nine Class A locos I purchased.  I also have just a single 3 car ICR on order despite the fact that my period of interest is 1950 - 2000. Compare with an order for thirteen Park Royals.

Again looking at the list, it would seem there is a reasonable case for a Class 80 release, (much more so than the Hunslets). However, even if the Hunslets and Blue & Crimson Coaches sell, it might be a good idea to park that for the time being and attempt to kick start sales a bit with something like the AEC railcars, even a drip feed of these.  I would buy every version offered and at least six C Class locos.

As always you have my support and respect for what you do. Thank you Tom

Loco/Railcar	No. in Class	Service Period	Notes
Class 800	3	1939- 1962	Redundant after 1955
AEC Railcar	60 CIE, 20 GNRI	1950-1984	Last 8 years as Push Pulls
A Class	60	1955-1995
C Class	34	1956 - 1986	6 with NIR until 1997
121 Class	15	1961 - 2008
141 Class	37	1962 - 2010
181 Class	12	1966 - 2009
101 Class Hunslet	3	1970-1999	Limited use beyond 1980
80 Class (Thumpers)	22	1975-2011	3 sets leased by IR '87-'90
071 Class	18 IR, 3 NIR	1977 - Present
201 Class	32 IE, 2 NIR	1994- Present

 

Well said Tom…..very valid points

1 hour ago, Ironroad said:

The Class 89 is a class of 1 and has sold better than the A class”

And why wouldn’t it-it was sold in conjunction with a major UK retailer-the 001s wasn’t. 

[NIRCLASS80]

I would have thought even with the limited Irish market the A class that had a service life of basically 40 years would have out sold the 89. After all if memory serves me correctly there were about 17 different running numbers manufactured. 
Class 89 in reality would have had a service life of little over 10 years in total at best on the east coast main line corridor. 
It really shows how limited the Irish market is, and the spike in demand during the Covid pandemic is well and truly over. 
 

Even the activity and model forums like this one or RMWeb is a lot slower these days. 

[Warbonnet]

13 hours ago, Ironroad said:

Firstly, the apples to apples comment was a response to BosKonay’s posting “ The Class 89 is a class of 1 and has sold better than the A class” I don’t know how this separate posting got tagged onto my response to John. But regardless I don’t think the comparison is fair as considering the scale and diversity of the British market I would expect even a class of one such as this would outsell even the most common Irish class on the Irish market.

 

Beyond that, it is worth re reading your posting on Jan 21. The tone of this was quite dire and if I may I’ll quote a few extracts. 

“We can see a big slow down in purchases” 

“The sad reality is that there is likely to be less and less offerings in Irish outline as a result if the trend is a continuous one. “

“But if everyone is full up, then our output will likely severely restrict going forwards.”

“With the NIR stuff, if you want to see an 80 Class in the future, the decision to tool one is entirely dependent on the sales of the Hunslets and these coaches.”

So forgive me for reaching the conclusion that with all of the backlog coming to market this year clearing the decks), nothing on the agenda beyond this year, and the statements above, that we are at the end of the road. My reaction to this was to try and provide you with thoughts on what may be at the root of the slowdown in sales through the lens of a customer and while your colleague viewed this as “rude” I was somewhat heartened if not entirely reassured by some of the things you have said since.

As for the slow sales of the  rerun of the 141/181 class locos by another producer, it may be that while in the “sweetspot” this was overly ambitious in terms of the quantities produced. Many of us do purchase on the basis of as you put it “As we say, if it's what you want, grab it.” and I have 13 of these locos from the original run. 

I don’t think we are “full up”, I think the slowdown is more due to a few offerings that have limited interest, despite the beauty of the modelling.

I have appended a table to put this in perspective.

This is not intended to be a comprehensive listing; rather it is a list of items already offered or coming models, plus a mooted item and a couple of what I believe are highly desired items.

 

The number in class and length of time in service can usually be used as a measure of marketability.  So this list clearly demonstrates that there has been a very deliberate attempt to hit the “sweetspots” by that other producer and in general given the scarcity of these items they seem to have been successful launches. But by the same  measurements I was surprised by IRMs  announcements of the 800’s and the Hunslets. The 800 is iconic but a bit limited from a modeller's perspective (there was a lot of discussion on this forum as to what would be desirable) and I think collectors wishing to display them in glass cases are a bigger market. As for the Hunslets, they really only saw service for 10 years and were displaced in 1980 by the 111 class, a model of which was already available to haul the Mk 2 NIR liveried coaches you had already released.  Not to forget models of 201 class nos. 208 & 209 were also available. 

But despite seeing these offerings as very very limited, knowing they will be of a very high standard and in the spirit of my continuous support for you I ordered one 800 and two Hunslets, but compare that to the nine Class A locos I purchased.  I also have just a single 3 car ICR on order despite the fact that my period of interest is 1950 - 2000. Compare with an order for thirteen Park Royals.

Again looking at the list, it would seem there is a reasonable case for a Class 80 release, (much more so than the Hunslets). However, even if the Hunslets and Blue & Crimson Coaches sell, it might be a good idea to park that for the time being and attempt to kick start sales a bit with something like the AEC railcars, even a drip feed of these.  I would buy every version offered and at least six C Class locos.

As always you have my support and respect for what you do. Thank you Tom

Loco/Railcar	No. in Class	Service Period	Notes
Class 800	3	1939- 1962	Redundant after 1955
AEC Railcar	60 CIE, 20 GNRI	1950-1984	Last 8 years as Push Pulls
A Class	60	1955-1995
C Class	34	1956 - 1986	6 with NIR until 1997
121 Class	15	1961 - 2008
141 Class	37	1962 - 2010
181 Class	12	1966 - 2009
101 Class Hunslet	3	1970-1999	Limited use beyond 1980
80 Class (Thumpers)	22	1975-2011	3 sets leased by IR '87-'90
071 Class	18 IR, 3 NIR	1977 - Present
201 Class	32 IE, 2 NIR	1994- Present

 

Hi Tom,

Many thanks for that. My query was merely about the A Class v Class 89. I wasn't calling the rest of your points out, as I felt they were measured and a lot of them made sense, but I will go through your points to give you a point of view from our side and put some industry experience into the mix.

Re the Class 89 v A Class. I was surprised a one off electric loco outsold our most common diesel. Electrics are hard to sell in themselves, and are not as popular in the UK as diesels and steam (which is sad as I am personally a fan of electric locos!). As @NIRCLASS80 states its a one off in 3 basic liveries. But still, there wasnt much in it. The original run of MM 141s beat both, but that was a time when there was nothing else available in Irish outline RTR and we all bought them in droves, myself included.

I accept my tone was downbeat, but it came from a place of honesty. But I did say "less offerings" rather than "no offerings".

I think it also needs to be remembered that a new locomotive project to deliver is circa half a million euro in costs. A railcar is almost twice that. It's scary numbers we have to deal with, be brave with and be sure it's the right decision to make. We get it wrong, we could end up losing our homes, we are a business after all. 

Regarding the 141 second run, I have been informed of the size of the production run, and it was quite low. As I said previously, we also saw 201s in said sweet spot hang around on shelves for a few years before our wagons arrived. 

Another one for the context of the sweetspot; We recently produced IR and IE Mark 2 coaches. We thought they'd fly; next level detail, orange and black icons, interior lighting etc etc. They were slow. The NIR Mark 2s outsold them. There is nothing guaranteed in this business as we have found out.

H Vans and Palvans for your mixed goods trains can also be seen as "sweet spot", have sold okay, but wont break too many records. Our Park Royals are pretty much sold out in many running numbers, but again, the run is a third of the size of the MM Craven first run. Again, points to a market that has changed. 

This is not anyone's fault, I am not calling you or anyone else out (as I said, your response was measured and you made good points), it was just offering a hint of reality of where we find the market right now. 

Regarding the Hunslets and the 800s, as I have hinted, one has done quite well, the other is not as well, but both are tiny runs, less than half of the A class in both cases. We knew this, they're priced accordingly, there will likely ever be one run. One makes sense as a dip into proper, quality, accurate Irish steam, and has many fans beyond our shores, the other offers the perfect locomotive to go with our NIR Mark 2s in every livery, and even some of our freight in fert wagons and bubbles as well as 42ft flats. They operated for over 20 years and were an everyday sight in Dublin for well over 10 years. A C would sell better, of course, and we will do the C, but what comes beyond that that is a "dead cert?"

It's also hard to park the Hunslets and sell something else for the following reasons; The people who ordered them expect them to be delivered by a certain date, as in very soon. We have already spent significant money on tooling it, so we need to get that money back in through sales. Pausing it, and starting an AEC railcar from scratch would need a significant amount of money spent on it to tool, and we would have to spend circa 800k to deliver it before getting money back in through sales in approx 3 years time! It's not how this industry works sadly. Also, the Hunslets are finished production (more news there soon!) so it's moot, but the point stands. You cant just drop something you've spent a significant amount of money on, promised to customers and start something else which would need even more investment. We deliver a model, we sell it, collect the money, and roll it into the next model. 

The Hunslets make more sense over an 80 class as they're cheaper to make, cheaper for customers to buy, compliment our range of models (and we like to do a range that has joined up thinking) and people buy more locos than units. It is the buying pattern we see in the UK, and here with the ICR. Someone may buy 5 A Classes or 141s, but only 1 or 2 units, as an example.

I hope the above responses are taken as clarification on my comments and also just giving the viewpoint as a manufacturer. As I said, your input and suggestions have been well thought out and welcome, and in some cases make sense, and in others, don't quite work out. We do appreciate the support you have given us down the years through buying our models, and that is the most fundamental thing. 

 

11 hours ago, ttc0169 said:

Well said Tom…..very valid points

And why wouldn’t it-it was sold in conjunction with a major UK retailer-the 001s wasn’t. 

Hi Noel,

The A Classes were sold through Irelands biggest model retailer, along with other traders like the late Chris Dyer and Dave Bracken. We were happy with the sales performance of the A and would certainly take their sales now.

The Class 89 was even split between us and rails, and as per the comments above, is a niche electric class of one, compared to a 40 year career of Irelands largest Diesel class with many more liveries. A Class 37 or 50 outselling the A? Every day of the week I would expect it. The 89? I was blown away tbh and did not expect it. Show's we should've charged more for the Metrovicks in hindsight. 

Cheers!

Fran 

[Ironroad]

Hi Fran, thank you for the elaboration.

Just to clarify one point, I wasn't suggesting that you pause the Hunslet project, rather I was suggesting that despite the natural progression to a class 80 release. it might be a good idea to park that in favour of the AEC Railcar. 

All the best Tom

[Brunel273]

A Class 80 is a must for me. The Larne line carried me to school for years, blue seats, that unmistakable engine note, damp mornings and sea air at the harbour. That is not just a model, it is memory.

 

I have also taken the plunge on the NIR maroon and the  blue Hunslets, together with six matching coaches. They are beautiful pieces and a real testament to how far Irish outline modelling has come.

 

The staggered arrival is probably no bad thing. It softens the financial impact and, truth be told, extends the anticipation. The steady drip model, at the right pace, feels exactly right.

 

Well done to all at Accurascale. They have genuinely changed the landscape.

[Brunel273]

i’m also in the market for the 70 Class- if I recall correctly, these were the staple locomotives that took me to school during the early 1970s on the Larne Line

Fran, is there any possibility that these are on the list?

 

[leslie10646]

Ah, @Warbonnet, you must be delighted with all these suggestions to spend YOUR money.

Not that I will ever get a chance to prove it, but if you brought out a GNR Class VS, it would outsell your equally "pipe-dream" Class 70s and Class 80s TOGETHER. 

The real secret, I suspect, is that that whatever prototype you choose it should have been in use North and South, so a Class 80 has some mileage in it.

I still haven't raised the money for a Hunslet, as the weather has been so bad that I can't take my "toy" tanks outside to photograph them for eBay!

C'est la vie ........

Edited February 23 by leslie10646

[Mol_PMB]

9 minutes ago, leslie10646 said:

The real secret, I suspect, is that that whatever prototype you choose it should have been in use North and South, so a C Class has some mileage in it.

Fixed your typo there, Leslie! 

 

 

[leslie10646]

10 minutes ago, Mol_PMB said:

Fixed your typo there, Leslie! 

 

 

And I've corrected it back!

The C Class will come, never fear, but in my lifetime?

[Galteemore]

A loco used North and south is the criteria then ? Here’s one, which crossed the border several times a day ! 

[Mol_PMB]

This amused me over on rmweb:

So, apart from those pesky big island Electrostars it must be ICR, 80 class, AEC and perhaps a Tokyu 2600 or a DART? 

[jhb171achill]

1 hour ago, Mol_PMB said:

This amused me over on rmweb:

So, apart from those pesky big island Electrostars it must be ICR, 80 class, AEC and perhaps a Tokyu 2600 or a DART? 

Wow! I'm frothed out...... there has to be an AEC set in there somewhere!

[leslie10646]

1 hour ago, Mol_PMB said:

This amused me over on rmweb:

So, apart from those pesky big island Electrostars it must be ICR, 80 class, AEC and perhaps a Tokyu 2600 or a DART? 

Nonsense!

Accurascale are working on  the ultimate Pacers, 150s, 153s, 156s and 158/9s. Then the electric 455s, 5-WES (Class 442) and when they're finished those, all the hopeless Modernisation Plan DMUs.

[jhb171achill]

1 hour ago, Galteemore said:

A loco used North and south is the criteria then ? Here’s one, which crossed the border several times a day ! 

Senior had Multiple Conniptions, attacks of the Screaming Fits, and Grade 3 Heeby-Jeebys at the state of their track, while resident GNR engineer in Enniskillen. So much so that on one occasion he inspected the line for them as a favour, in his own time, on a Sunday, as he was friendly with their traffic manager. The remedy was a trainload or two of GNR ballast from Goraghwood Quarry, and creative accounting to hide the cost of it in the GNR's Western Division PW budget!

[leslie10646]

1 hour ago, Galteemore said:

A loco used North and south is the criteria then ? Here’s one, which crossed the border several times a day ! 

1 hour ago, Galteemore said:

A loco used North and south is the criteria then ? Here’s one, which crossed the border several times a day ! 

A steam-age C Class?

A steam age C Class?

I couldn't find a "Raspberry" Imogi  for @Galteemore's reply!

Edited February 23 by leslie10646

[jhb171achill]

Just now, leslie10646 said:

A steam age C Class?

A silver or green one could well have met a SLNCR steam loco in Sligo, as well as the last of CIE's ex-MGWR 2.4.0s......

[murphaph]

Interesting that the NIR mk2's sold better than the Vic Berry IR/IE ones. I bought both from the 90's but I'm trying to figure out why the NIR ones did better. The IR ones were limited to a very specific era. Did the NIR corporate livery ones alone outsell the IR ones or as a whole? Could it be that modellers in Britain who dip their toes into modelling Irish outline have a natural tendency to opt for NIR because it's UK and somehow still a bit familiar to GB outline? I mean the NIR liveries from the early 80's on clearly lean on BR practices with all that blue and white. It'll certainly be interesting to see what happens with the Hunslets.

[Mol_PMB]

8 hours ago, murphaph said:

Interesting that the NIR mk2's sold better than the Vic Berry IR/IE ones. I bought both from the 90's but I'm trying to figure out why the NIR ones did better. The IR ones were limited to a very specific era. Did the NIR corporate livery ones alone outsell the IR ones or as a whole? Could it be that modellers in Britain who dip their toes into modelling Irish outline have a natural tendency to opt for NIR because it's UK and somehow still a bit familiar to GB outline? I mean the NIR liveries from the early 80's on clearly lean on BR practices with all that blue and white. It'll certainly be interesting to see what happens with the Hunslets.

It could be the lack of a gen van to complete a train of the IR/IE ones?

Also from a model perspective were many modellers sated with Murphy Cravens and aircon Mk2s, and the previous Bachmann (even Lima and Hornby) Irish Mk2 offerings?

From a prototype viewpoint they were relatively short-lived in Ireland and not very popular to travel in.
I recall their tatty patched-up secondhand origins being only too obvious to the passenger. Also there were only a couple of sets, they were much less numerous than Cravens or aircon Mk2s. 
 

 

[Flying Snail]

I think its a combination of factors. Agree that there's likely an impact from other IE stock being available. For me, in terms of CIE/IR/IE nostalgia both the Cravens and aircon Mk2s would be ahead of the ViC Berry Mk2s (all of which are behind the Mk3 for me).

But also there's demographics to consider - in addition to the potential pull of NI for other UK based modellers, my understanding is that traditionally theres been a bigger modelling community in NI than in the Republic (the distribution of modelling clubs seems to bear that out) which would naturally lean NIR.

Then there's the fact that the NI Mk2s came south of the border along the most heavily populated corridor in the Republic, so there's also a substantial part of the market down here that remembers them.

[Brendan8056]

I purchased the NIR and the IR versions, as I travelled on both types on holidays. I had already done the rebuilt Dutch Van to go with the Murphy's release of IR livery Bachmann Mk2s, so was pleased to get a set of the IRM coaches. 

  Incidentally if Accurascale are wanting people to guess what MUs they are doing I note their Electrostar video has shots at Shepherdswell, where there are some 4CIG coaches at the adjacent "Heritage" railway, including a motor coach with Mk6 bogies, identical to the 80 class ones, and IRM have already done the correct trailer bogies. As a Southern Electric modeller  I do hope this means both types will be on their list for the near future. "Bournemouth Blue" upholstery was another common feature.

[Mol_PMB]

1 minute ago, Brendan8056 said:

I purchased the NIR and the IR versions, as I travelled on both types on holidays. I had already done the rebuilt Dutch Van to go with the Murphy's release of IR livery Bachmann Mk2s, so was pleased to get a set of the IRM coaches. 

  Incidentally if Accurascale are wanting people to guess what MUs they are doing I note their Electrostar video has shots at Shepherdswell, where there are some 4CIG coaches at the adjacent "Heritage" railway, including a motor coach with Mk6 bogies, identical to the 80 class ones, and IRM have already done the correct trailer bogies. As a Southern Electric modeller  I do hope this means both types will be on their list for the near future. "Bournemouth Blue" upholstery was another common feature.

Their Class 73 also has a variant of the same power bogies. 

[jhb171achill]

Likewise, I think it's a combination of factors. As one who remembers both, the NIR ones always seemed better kept. The overall Mk 2 design, compared to Cravens, are absolute rust buckets - awful things. The CIE / IE ones, I think, always just seemed what they were - second-hand, second-rate. On the other hand the NIR ones were introduced in a blaze of positive publicity as a "prestige" train - which compared to anything else on the island, especially on NIR at the time, they were.

[Mayner]

14 hours ago, Flying Snail said:

But also there's demographics to consider - in addition to the potential pull of NI for other UK based modellers, my understanding is that traditionally theres been a bigger modelling community in NI than in the Republic (the distribution of modelling clubs seems to bear that out) which would naturally lean NIR.

Then there's the fact that the NI Mk2s came south of the border along the most heavily populated corridor in the Republic, so there's also a substantial part of the market down here that remembers them.

There certainly seemed to be a greater interest in railway modelling in the north and east (particularly ex-GN,NCC territory) compared to the rest of the country, possibly because for a long time CIE was considered drab and un-interesting in comparison with the GN and NCC with their colourful (modernish) express locos smart rakes of uniform coaches. I once recall a railfan from Kilkenny speaking about finding the local early 50s railscene drab and boring and eventually modelling the GNR instead. 

NIR demonstrated a lot of courage and confidence in the future of the Enterprise (and the railways) with the early 1980s introduction of its 111-113 locomotives and two MK2 Enterprise carriage sets increasing the frequency of the Enterprise from 4 to 6 return workings daily at a time CIE Enterprise was made up mainly of Craven stock. 

Interestingly Model Irish Railways the main Irish kit producer between the 80s early 2000s was established by a group of Ulster based modellers, while during the last 20 or so years modellers in the "greater' Belfast area have been pro-active in encouraging Worsley Works to produced etched parts for  several of the distinctive railcar classes introduced by the UTA