Ernies Massive Irish 1930's to 2005 Photo Archive

[leslie10646]

2 hours ago, minister_for_hardship said:

Should have had more 500s, and forget about building the three enormous white (or is that green?) elephants.

The Late Drew Donaldson had a very high opinion of the 500s, a view shared by others, so yes, you are right that more of them would have been good, but I'm pretty sure that he wouldn't have agreed with you about the 800s!

They had the misfortune to be built just as war loomed (of course, there should never have been a war at all, but that's another issue) so never had a chance to show how good they were (or not). The Blessed Oliver put paid to any future they might have had by ordering the A Class in the mid-fifties.

Of course, for a country with little steam-able coal, they were a nonesense as even in 1939 the yanks were proving that diesels offered a future?

Now, having acted as an Agent provocateur, let me make another suggestion.

Perhaps Ireland should have looked at electric traction? There's a long and well reasoned article in IRRS Journal Volume 1 on railway electrification - it concluded that it wasn't on then (1947/8) as it would have wolfed up masses of capital and a high proportion of the electricity then generated. It DID touch on  battery power, which Dr Drumm had proved was workable and touched on partial electrification (like the "power islands" they're talking about today, to zap power into battery trains and which we will soon see - seventy years later).

Another what if?

[Mayner]

10 hours ago, Horsetan said:

Seems that the only tapered boilers that the GSR/CIE ever dealt with were those on the Woolwich Moguls. Everything else was strictly parallel.

Interestingly some of the large Coey era  GSWR 4-4-0s retained tapered boilers until rebuilt by the GSR with superheated boilers during the 1930s. Apparently tapered boilers were introduced during the 1900s to keep the axleloading of the 321 and 333 Class 4-4-0s within the Civil Engineers limits. Some of the 4-4-0s were rebuilt before the (1925) Amalgamation with new heavier frames, but retaining the original tapered boilers after axle loading was increased following the re-laying of the Main Line.

The 800 Class & Drumm Battery trains.

There was certainly an element of national pride in the 800 Class and Drumm Trains C&D also introduced 1939. C&D had a modern contemporary appearance not unlike the LMS Leyland articulated railcar set trialed on the Oxford-Cambridge line around the same time. C&D were let down by using refurbished batteries from the original Drumm trains A&B, the refurbished batteries becoming life expired after approx 5 years.

[Mayner]

On 10/12/2024 at 2:24 AM, leslie10646 said:

Now, having acted as an Agent provocateur, let me make another suggestion.

Perhaps Ireland should have looked at electric traction? There's a long and well reasoned article in IRRS Journal Volume 1 on railway electrification - it concluded that it wasn't on then (1947/8) as it would have wolfed up masses of capital and a high proportion of the electricity then generated. It DID touch on  battery power, which Dr Drumm had proved was workable and touched on partial electrification (like the "power islands" they're talking about today, to zap power into battery trains and which we will soon see - seventy years later).

Another what if?

There is a story of Bulleid explaining his concept of a fireless main-line  loco to a group of workers during an after dinner strole around the Tender Shop during his early days at Inchacore.  It appear the guys asked Bullied about his plans for a new loco and he drew up a sketch (concept drawing) of a fireless loco that would be 'topped up' at a series of charging stations around the network.  

I guess we will never know whether there is some truth to the story.

The ESB substantially increased it power generation capacity from Hydro and Peat from the late 40s onwards against a background of economic stagnation and a falling population.

The railways may have been seen as a means of absorbing some of the additional capacity in the same way as the GSR was enticed (manipulated) into building the Drumm Battery trains by the offer of 'cheap electricity' from the Shannon Scheme. 

Whatever about fireless locos topped up by lineside generating plants, development of the Drumm principal with partial electrification would have been feasible and fitted in with the social and economic aspirations of the 1st 'Inter-party' Government elected in 1948 (Declare a Republic, attempt to set up a 'Welfare State" (Mother and Child scheme) based on the UK model, and lay groundwork for the Republics economic transformation from the 60s onwards. 

A  change from a railway a railway that mainly exported cattle and people, to one that carried mineral and manufacturing outputs to the ports from the 60s to the 90s  to the contemporary railway that mainly transports commuters to their offices in the cities.

Faced with the reality of a stagnant economy, the railway worsening financial position, CIE had to modernise 'on the cheap" with diesel traction and cheaply built stock good for 20 or so years.

Still at the end of the day a modern variant of Drumm's Battery trains are likely to resume operation in Ireland over 90 years after the initial trials on the GSR. 

 

Edited December 11, 2024 by Mayner

[Irishswissernie]

On 27/11/2024 at 8:37 AM, Irishswissernie said:

In the pipeline I am working through a set of colour slides taken in June 1964 covering the UTA lines at that time

I'm still awaiting the remainder of these slides plus the details so in the meantime  here are some Dia Dema negatives taken in the early 1960's

x217 GNRI 1960 -xx -CA Lurgan WT 50.

x237GNRI 1965-08 Belfast Maysfield from train hauled by UG 48 going to Belfast Queens Quay.

x250 NCC  1964-06-28 Coleraine WT 10 on 6.35 ECS ex Londonderry.

 

 

[Irishswissernie]

I have uploaded this video of North Wall & Limerick Junction in June 2003 to the North Wall Topic but here's the flickr link here just to keep all my ramblings er photos / videos  on one topic.

 

[Irishswissernie]

CIE 1956-04-26 Youghal A17 yj140.

CB&SC 1958-05-xx Courtmacsherry C232 Excursion from Cork yj122.

CIE 1987-06-28 Tullamore yj147 DATE EDITED (twice!)

 

 

Edited December 16, 2024 by Irishswissernie

[David Holman]

Lovely stuff!

[geraghtyg]

18 hours ago, Irishswissernie said:

CIE 1956-04-26 Youghal A17 yj140.

CB&SC 1958-05-xx Courtmacsherry C232 Excursion from Cork yj122.

CIE 1982-06-28 Tullamore yj147

 

 

I believe the Mark 3s didn't arrive until 1984 so the date for tullamore may be incorrect. 

Great set of photos though, nonetheless.

[Mol_PMB]

4 hours ago, geraghtyg said:

I believe the Mark 3s didn't arrive until 1984 so the date for tullamore may be incorrect. 

Great set of photos though, nonetheless.

The first two Mk3s have been tipp-exed placing the date at 1987 or later, but the loco and other visible Mk3s have not. Purely on those livery proportions I’d estimate around 1989. 

[Irishswissernie]

I have amended the date to 1989. A number of the later slides with the 'YJ' ref letters at the beginning appear to have had the details added later so if anyone has reservations about the date please put a post on.

[leslie10646]

Lovely bright picture of the A Class at Youghal - a good buy on your behalf - pretty eye catching and an interesting set of coaching stock.

I even notice one of my  GSWR 10 ton brake vans in the background!

[Irishswissernie]

2 hours ago, Irishswissernie said:

I have amended the date to 1989. A number of the later slides with the 'YJ' ref letters at the beginning appear to have had the details added later so if anyone has reservations about the date please put a post on.

Jonathan Allen has a shot of 072 in Tip-ex and IR on the front taken on  1 April 1988 so taking into account

the foliage I am re-amending to 28 June 1987.

[Irishswissernie]

Cavan & Leitrim today.

C&L 1959-CA Mohill 6T y021.

C&L 1959-03-14 Ballinamore shed 10L ex CB&P & 4L.

C&L 1957-05-27 Arigna 4L JGD570125

 

 

[LNERW1]

The Arigna shot evokes so much. A picture paints a thousand words etc., but it really is captivating.

[Irishswissernie]

I was thinking in November that my Flickr site total hits since I started in a small way in 2009 with the demise of fotopic would reach 65 million by the end of 2024 but this figure was reached on friday. There has been the usual upsurge in daily hits pre Christmas which normally continues until the New Year, viewing the site probably acts as a relaxation from the hectic festive season plus the lack of much of interest on the TV!  I don't close for Christmas so watch out for more images over the next fortnight. Have a good Christmas and New Year everyone!

 

GNRI today.

GNRI 1959-05-12 Londonderry,Foyle Rd. U 202 JGD590814.

GNRI 1957-06-07 Omagh 204 LN1045.

GNRI 1957-06-05 Belturbet station interior.  LN999.

 

 

[Robert Shrives]

Hi ,

Great news on viewing figures and I wish you well for Christmas and 2025.  A big thank you for finding time to procure and process  pictures. 

I really enjoy all of them as a  window on the past, simpler times but will always enjoy orange diesels and stock. 

All the best

Robert   

[airfixfan]

Lovely shot of an U CLass qt Foyle Road

 Merry Xmas and keep them coming along.

[David Holman]

The Belturbut shot does it for me. Atmosphere in spades.

[leslie10646]

On 22/12/2024 at 6:25 PM, airfixfan said:

Lovely shot of an U CLass qt Foyle Road

 Merry Xmas and keep them coming along.

Interesting to see the U Class at Foyle Road - when I was doing my Summer Runabout in August 1964, there was a S Class on the 1015 from Derry most days, which I would pick up at Strabane.

However, on 6 August 1964, No.201 (UTA No.66) was on the train and by an unhappy circumstance, I only was able to travel with her from Portadown to Belfast, not very speedily!

Quite why she was on the train, my eighteen year old self did not ascertain. No.171 had gone to Derry on the previous day's 3pm train, and should have been on the 1015 on the 5th. She may have developed a fault and the little U Class was substituted.

A S Class was back on the 3.15 that afternoon in the shape of No.172 (UTA No.60) and ran well enough for me to risk the Omagh connection into the 5.08pm relief back to Belfast - which I made!

Takes you back ......

[Irishswissernie]

Madame has spent the nignt at Daugter No 3's house looking after one of the 3 month old twins who has a cold so as has had little sleep I have suggested that she has a nap whilst I amuse myself in my 'den' . I normally upload to Flickr on Christmas Morning at 6 am whilst the rest of the house; ie Annie and the Dogs are still fast asleep (Not like the old days when our 5 kids thought the ideal time was to wake up at about 2 am and start clamouring for their presents.)

Here is the Irish section of the upload.

GNRI 1956-04-28 Clones 202 on 9.00 Dublin- Enniskillen yj136.

CIE 1970 's Dublin Connolly 019 131 046 142 yj096.

Ballina, 087 Ca 2000  justa076.

CDRJC 1956-04-xx Donegal Town WACS2619.

GNRI 1962-03-17 Cork Glanmire Rd 207 IRRS Spl. JGD620232.

Now this is done what the xxxx am I going to do tomorrow  at 6am!

 

[Mol_PMB]

6 minutes ago, Irishswissernie said:

Now this is done what the xxxx am I going to do tomorrow  at 6am!

    

 

I hope you can have a relaxing lie-in tomorrow morning then! Another wonderful selection of photos - many thanks.

The Connolly shot is interesting for the variety of traction and the variety of shades of orange - proof that they didn't always match and that variations in paint colour, fading and weathering could give substantial differences even on fairly clean locos and carriages.

 

Before my time period, didn't the GNR 4-4-0s look wonderful in blue, whether they were big or small ones!

[airfixfan]

Railcar 18 at Donegal Town

[Newtoncork]

What amazes me are the women wandering around the turntable at Cork! 

[minister_for_hardship]

2 hours ago, Newtoncork said:

What amazes me are the women wandering around the turntable at Cork! 

The railtour WAGs they would be called now!

[leslie10646]

Simply breath-taking, Ernie - thanks!

The shot of the U Class at Clones is like a painting, while, of course, EVERY photo of No.207 is to be exalted.

Who took them - just lovely.

By the way Minister, there were invariably a good number of ladies on those early IRRs tours and today, the clientelle on a steam tour in GB is 50/50.

[Galteemore]

21 minutes ago, leslie10646 said:

Simply breath-taking, Ernie - thanks!

The shot of the U Class at Clones is like a painting, while, of course, EVERY photo of No.207 is to be exalted.

Who took them - just lovely.

By the way Minister, there were invariably a good number of ladies on those early IRRs tours and today, the clientelle on a steam tour in GB is 50/50.

Some of these ladies were very adventurous, taking part in the ultimate Wild West of railtours, the LRTL trip to Dingle.

Edited December 25, 2024 by Galteemore

[Patrick Davey]

Imagine getting a train - steam of course - from Dublin to Enniskillen......

Nice

[Irishswissernie]

8 hours ago, leslie10646 said:

The shot of the U Class at Clones is like a painting, while, of course, EVERY photo of No.207 is to be exalted.

Who took them - just lovely.

I think the U at Clones was probably by TJ Edgington whilst 207was John Dewing. 

[Galteemore]

Agree with Leslie, whoever took it, it must rank in the top ten of colour Irish rail photos from that era.

[exciecoachbuilder]

On 24/12/2024 at 3:11 PM, Mol_PMB said:

I hope you can have a relaxing lie-in tomorrow morning then! Another wonderful selection of photos - many thanks.

The Connolly shot is interesting for the variety of traction and the variety of shades of orange - proof that they didn't always match and that variations in paint colour, fading and weathering could give substantial differences even on fairly clean locos and carriages.

 

Before my time period, didn't the GNR 4-4-0s look wonderful in blue, whether they were big or small ones!

Yeah, the Connolly station picture is an absolute gem, and it captures 1970's C.I.E perfectly. In regards to the paint work on the vehicles, CIE always used the same paint back then, the same mixing procedure etc. The different shades are no doubt due to age. If you look at the 141 and the 121 class on the right of the picture, the 121 looks like it hasn't had a lick of paint in years, whereas the 141 looks like it had a recent enough repaint. The paint was always supplied from the same manufacturer, and the spraying technique ( until 1999) usually was , orange sprayed on the entire coach/ loco, then the black bands were marked out and hand painted on.. Paul.

[Mayner]

7 hours ago, Patrick Davey said:

Imagine getting a train - steam of course - from Dublin to Enniskillen......

Nice

Depends on whether your an enthusiast or an 'ordinary' passenger being from Dublin an Aunt and an Uncle once took the train from Amiens St to Bundoran for a holiday in the early 50s. My excitement at their having travelled on the Bundoran Express was cut down to earth by their comment that they train journey was slow seemed to 'take forever". 

[Irishswissernie]

CDRJC 1958 CA Killybegs 19 on turntable 249001.

CIE 1959- CA Dublin Broadstone y014.

CIE 1960's  Dublin Broadstone (3).

IE CA2005 Drogheda Railcar Depot  RefJu194

 

[airfixfan]

Nice photo of Killybegs unusual angle

[David Holman]

Fintonagh/Swillybegs turntable has similar situation with encroaching foliage! Been meaning to trim it back a little, but have a good excuse not to now.

[Irishswissernie]

Royal Mail finally delivered this one today and think it might be a good one to start the New Year off.

SLNCR 1956-07-xx Sligo Railbus A (2nd) after re-bodying ref25j+002

I have done a bit of 'ferreting ' amongst my reference books and note that after re-bodying in 1950 it had a grey rather than white roof. Also one of the panels has a slightly different shade of green.