Customs & VAT

[irishmail]

 

Avoid using Anpost is sending items to and from Ireland.  They are now a complete sham!

Anpost is now a complete joke!   Just checked on progress of package sent from my Brother in law from England, now its being sent back.   Track says 'we could not deliver your post. We will try to return to sender'!!!   

1.  Why could they not deliver?  they have not even tried.

2. What do they mean by 'We will try to return it to sender'

the following copied & pasted from Anpost tracking info.

21 September 2021 22:42

We could not deliver your post. We will try to return it to the sender.

20 September 2021 13:19

Your delivery has been sorted DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

20 September 2021 13:18

We have your post in DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

20 September 2021 13:17

Your delivery was received by An Post in DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

Edited September 22, 2021 by irishmail

[murphaph]

That's simply unforgivable. The parcel doesn't even make it out of the mails centre and gets sent back?! I think people in Ireland need to start documenting these incidents and making formal complaints to Comreg and/or the responsible minister. What about setting up a Facebook group for affected customers to post their experiences and shame the company into doing what it should be doing as a matter of course?

[irishmail]

7 minutes ago, murphaph said:

That's simply unforgivable. The parcel doesn't even make it out of the mails centre and gets sent back?! I think people in Ireland need to start documenting these incidents and making formal complaints to Comreg and/or the responsible minister. What about setting up a Facebook group for affected customers to post their experiences and shame the company into doing what it should be doing as a matter of course?

I am seriously thinking of sending an email to my TD/Minister as Anpost are a complete joke now.  They used to be fine and never had any bother with them, but I think since the customs/VAT changes came in July Anpsost don't seem to have a clue.  They are not even bothering to contact the recipients as to why their mail is being returned to sender (That's if they do return it!)

As I mentioned in an earlier post, there are lots of complaints/comments from people affected by this on the Anpost Facebook page and trust pilot reviews.  Anpost just fob you off with feeble excuses.  

Looking at @Mayner's post he got a clear explanation from customs and it seems that anpost do just not have a clue or resources to know what they are doing.

Sorry for the rant, but I am not very happy at the moment!

[Mayner]

53 minutes ago, irishmail said:

 

1.  Why could they not deliver?  they have not even tried.

2. What do they mean by 'We will try to return it to sender'

 

"We could not deliver your post. We will try to return it to sender." actually means we got an error message when we attempted to input the electronic customs declaration received from the Royal Mail into the An Post system.

"We will try to return to sender" basically means we will return the item (from the Athlone Mail Centre) when we have a truck load of parcels ready to return to the UK.

I am planning to follow up with a formal complaint to An Post and follow up with the regulator if we do not get a satisfactory response. 

I would recommend contacting the Royal Mail rather than An Post if you want to take the matter further.

Ask the Royal Mail to investigate the incident asking for an explanation asking why An Post were unable to deliver and request  details of the specific issues identified with the electronic customs declaration.

Edited September 22, 2021 by Mayner

[DART8118]

Irishmail, If you live anywhere close to the DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12, a visit first thing this morning to collect you item might be a good plan.

Edited September 22, 2021 by DART8118
Wrong name

[murphaph]

If it's anything like the large sorting offices here you won't get past the gate.

[irishmail]

5 minutes ago, DART8118 said:

Irishmail, If you live anywhere close to the DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12, a visit first thing this morning to collect you item might be a good plan.

If I was in the Dublin area then I would have done, however I am the opposite end of the country.  

[irishmail]

Quote from @Mayner's post

"Customs explained that An Post is responsible for entering customs data and collecting vat and duties due on behalf of the Revenue, but also responsible for contacting the sender or person receiving the package to make any necessary amendments if there is a problem with the electronic customs declaration transmitted by the sending postal authority to An Post."

I think here is the problem.  Anpost are not making any effort to contact 'their' customers!    

[amdaley]

This message appears on the Royal Mail International incidents update site.

https://personal.help.royalmail.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/5317

Start date: 16th September 2021
Latest Update: 16th September 2021
End date: Ongoing
Incident: Customs delays

Latest Update
We’re sorry for the disruption some customers are experiencing with some services to Ireland at the moment. This disruption is being caused by the implementation of new import controls which are resulting in the return of some items by the Irish Customs authorities. Royal Mail remains in discussions with our postal partner, AnPost with a view to help identify new processes that could improve the flow of mail items into Ireland and reduce the return of items. In parallel, we have a number of potential alternative services business customers may want to use to post to Ireland including Click and Drop .. We’ll provide further updates to customers as we have them.

This is the message I'm getting for one of my packages from the UK on An Post site. My second package is still in London I believe because Royal Mail won't forward it here because An Post can't get their act together.

Christ what a country we live in 

 

22 September 2021 17:09

We have your post in DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

20 September 2021 14:37

Your delivery has been sorted DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

20 September 2021 14:33

We have your post in DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

17 September 2021 13:13

Your delivery has been sorted DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

17 September 2021 13:09

We have your post in DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

17 September 2021 13:08

Your delivery was received by An Post in DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

 

Edited September 22, 2021 by amdaley

[irishmail]

Pity Anpost do not have this information and inform 'their' customers of whats going on.  

I was chatting to one of 'their' 'customer' advisers a short while ago trying to find out what was going on then he decided to just end the chat!!!

Have lost all confidence in An post now.  Just feel sorry for our local friendly post person who ends up getting all the flack from irate and frustrated customers.

 

[amdaley]

5 minutes ago, irishmail said:

Pity Anpost do not have this information and inform 'their' customers of whats going on.  

I was chatting to one of 'their' 'customer' advisers a short while ago trying to find out what was going on then he decided to just end the chat!!!

Have lost all confidence in An post now.  Just feel sorry for our local friendly post person who ends up getting all the flack from irate and frustrated customers.

 

Where I live in South Kerry we have a fantastic postman John who never misses a beat.

When I moved here about 15 years ago someone sent me a birthday card but didn't have my address.

They wrote my name & the town where I live, that's all 

Credit to our postie he found me with the card.

I wish the rest of An Post staff were like that 

[amdaley]

I got the usual An post message this evening when checking online.

 

22 September 2021 17:17

Your delivery has been sorted DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

22 September 2021 17:09

We have your post in DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

 

I've now sent the following email to my local Td's & Councillors as well as Michael Martin, Eamon Ryan & Mary Lou McDonald.

Nothing may come of it but at least its worth a try.

Hello *****.

Would you please contact someone in An Post & tell them to get their act together.

People all over the country are waiting for packages & parcels which are stacked up in Dublin 12 & elsewhere because An Post isn't following the customs rules regarding declarations.

 "Customs explained that An Post is responsible for entering customs data and collecting vat and duties due on behalf of the Revenue, but also responsible for contacting the sender or person receiving the package to make any necessary amendments if there is a problem with the electronic customs declaration transmitted by the sending postal authority to An Post."

 Instead of contacting the senders or recipients An Post is sending packages & parcels back from where they came. It's even happening to people who have paid the Customs Vat & the An Post charge.

Regards.

*I would urge everyone to contact their local TD's on this matter.*

Edited September 22, 2021 by amdaley

[irishmail]

This is the transcript from my online chat earlier today before  the An post agent ended the chat.   Spoke to brother in law short while ago and he said he put value £20.00 and model railway items on the packet.   Obviously the staff in the Dublin 12 sorting office can not be bothered to read!  

Seán 17:06
Hi, john how can we help ?
john 17:07
I want to know why my letter was not delivered and may be sent back.
Seán 17:11
checking the tracking it seems that the item has been processed to be returned to sender I’m afraid. The customs
declaration which was provided electronically was insufficient. I would advise to refer to the sender to arrange for the item
to be re-issued with the correct information (as per the changes introduced on 1st July) once it arrives back in the country
of origin. If you check our website here: https://www.anpost.com/Media-Centre/News/Customs-declaration-Postal-items
you will be able to see what information is required for an item to be cleared. I am sorry I cannot offer you a more
favourable update on the item today but I hope this information helps you!
john 17:13
it is a gift from a family member. why was i not informed about this and why is it being sent back
what did it say on the declaration form?
Seán 17:14
It looks to be missing something called a TARIC code. You'll need to ask the sender to ensure that complete electronic
data accompanies the item including a 10 digit TARIC code. They can visit our TARIC code finder to see exactly what
information is needed: https://www.anpost.com/Commerce/Parcel-Solutions/International-Parcels/Find-a-TARICCommodity-
code
john 17:16
so why can it not be delivered? It must cost more to send back to uk and postage already paid for delivery to Ireland
Seán 17:19
As advised it failed its clearance check due to the declaration issue and therefore had to be returned for the information to
be fixed. We cannot deliver the item if it fails this.
john 17:21
What happens now, Tracking says will 'try and return to sender which dont sound hopeful. and the package contained
model railway items which are except from customs charges and is a gift from family.
Seán 17:23
The item was scanned leaving last night, the tracking will update on the Royal Mail website showing it being delivered
back to the sender. They an then get this info fixed and have the item resent and then there should be no issues.
john 17:25
so what you are saying is that we can not longer send items to our family between UK & Ireland now. This was not a
business or sales transaction.
Read
Seán 17:28
As long as the item is sent with the correct customs information there would be no issues with the item coming in.
Unfortunately I have given you all the information I can. It was nice talking to you have a great day.
Seán has closed the chat.
How would you r

[amdaley]

31 minutes ago, irishmail said:

This is the transcript from my online chat earlier today before  the An post agent ended the chat.   Spoke to brother in law short while ago and he said he put value £20.00 and model railway items on the packet.   Obviously the staff in the Dublin 12 sorting office can not be bothered to read!  

Seán 17:06
Hi, john how can we help ?
john 17:07
I want to know why my letter was not delivered and may be sent back.
Seán 17:11
checking the tracking it seems that the item has been processed to be returned to sender I’m afraid. The customs
declaration which was provided electronically was insufficient. I would advise to refer to the sender to arrange for the item
to be re-issued with the correct information (as per the changes introduced on 1st July) once it arrives back in the country
of origin. If you check our website here: https://www.anpost.com/Media-Centre/News/Customs-declaration-Postal-items
you will be able to see what information is required for an item to be cleared. I am sorry I cannot offer you a more
favourable update on the item today but I hope this information helps you!
john 17:13
it is a gift from a family member. why was i not informed about this and why is it being sent back
what did it say on the declaration form?
Seán 17:14
It looks to be missing something called a TARIC code. You'll need to ask the sender to ensure that complete electronic
data accompanies the item including a 10 digit TARIC code. They can visit our TARIC code finder to see exactly what
information is needed: https://www.anpost.com/Commerce/Parcel-Solutions/International-Parcels/Find-a-TARICCommodity-
code
john 17:16
so why can it not be delivered? It must cost more to send back to uk and postage already paid for delivery to Ireland
Seán 17:19
As advised it failed its clearance check due to the declaration issue and therefore had to be returned for the information to
be fixed. We cannot deliver the item if it fails this.
john 17:21
What happens now, Tracking says will 'try and return to sender which dont sound hopeful. and the package contained
model railway items which are except from customs charges and is a gift from family.
Seán 17:23
The item was scanned leaving last night, the tracking will update on the Royal Mail website showing it being delivered
back to the sender. They an then get this info fixed and have the item resent and then there should be no issues.
john 17:25
so what you are saying is that we can not longer send items to our family between UK & Ireland now. This was not a
business or sales transaction.
Read
Seán 17:28
As long as the item is sent with the correct customs information there would be no issues with the item coming in.
Unfortunately I have given you all the information I can. It was nice talking to you have a great day.
Seán has closed the chat.
How would you r

Think Seán needs to take a course on how to deal with the public

[murphaph]

Taric codes aren't required for gifts coming into the EU either. Disgraceful stuff but at least you are getting more information. Much more pressure needs to be brought to bear on them from above.

[declan64]

I emptied my Hattons trunk earlier this week with the delivery coming via DHL.

I receive an email and text this morning from DHL looking for an import duty and fees payment (which they're not going to get from me).

I've contacted Hattons to either sort it or I'm asking DHL to return the items and looking for a full refund. I can live without the items for now and Hattons need to feel a little pain for this.

Hattons have been one of the last usable UK channels given their ability to handle Irish VAT and the very useful trunk service but something that was working a few weeks ago is clearly broken now.

[BosKonay]

Arguably, supporting local like http://www.marksmodels.com  works out cheaper, faster and less trouble?

[amdaley]

20 minutes ago, declan64 said:

I emptied my Hattons trunk earlier this week with the delivery coming via DHL.

I receive an email and text this morning from DHL looking for an import duty and fees payment (which they're not going to get from me).

I've contacted Hattons to either sort it or I'm asking DHL to return the items and looking for a full refund. I can live without the items for now and Hattons need to feel a little pain for this.

Hattons have been one of the last usable UK channels given their ability to handle Irish VAT and the very useful trunk service but something that was working a few weeks ago is clearly broken now.

Let us know how you get on with Hattons ?

[amdaley]

3 minutes ago, BosKonay said:

Arguably, supporting local like http://www.marksmodels.com  works out cheaper, faster and less trouble?

Agreed but the problem is that Marks don't have the stuff that people need.

I have two packages of DCCconcepts stuff stuck in customs at the moment, none of which Marks even advertise let alone have in stock.

[declan64]

Hattons have requested I pay DHL and they will refund me. The package is out for delivery today - the man in the DHL van even texted me.

I've paid DHL now and I assume Hattons will do the needful. I've still asked them what has gone wrong here as I haven't had this problem before.

I do use Marks and if I was local in Dublin I'd probably use them more.

With eBay from UK sellers no longer an economical option since Brexit I do find pre-owned stuff from Hattons that I simply couldn't find anywhere else (apart from eBay) not to mention their broader range than Marks.
The trunk service is also really handy to keep shipping costs down.

With the recent price inflation in the UK, Marks are actually very competitive now so well worth going to if you can find what you are looking for.

[Georgeconna]

1 hour ago, amdaley said:

Agreed but the problem is that Marks don't have the stuff that people need.

I have two packages of DCCconcepts stuff stuck in customs at the moment, none of which Marks even advertise let alone have in stock.

As I said before, Big opportunity for the Irish shops here but they are a bit stuck in a rut with stuff like this although Marks did have cobalts at one stage

[murphaph]

The trunk service offered by Hattons is very attractive to an awful lot of customers who buy (or would buy) a lot of smaller bits and pieces. I wish more retailers would offer it. 

Does Marks sell any second hand stuff online or is it only in the bricks and mortar store?

[Georgeconna]

16 hours ago, amdaley said:

Think Seán needs to take a course on how to deal with the public

"as long as the item is sent with the correct customs information there would be no issues with the item coming in"

sorry but this is the senders issue, The information needed was not supplied. What are they supposed to do make up the Taric codes on import? sorry that is just not done and there is where the issue was.

Daft that it cant be resolved here while IM is dealing with them though.

Also for any one that has a Magazine subscription from the UK a lad has told me An post are looking to collect about a fiver for the pleasure of customs clearing these.

 

 

[amdaley]

7 minutes ago, Georgeconna said:

As I said before, Big opportunity for the Irish shops here but they are a bit stuck in a rut with stuff like this although Marks did have cobalts at one stage

They still have them but at a premium.

[murphaph]

Just now, Georgeconna said:

"as long as the item is sent with the correct customs information there would be no issues with the item coming in"

sorry but this is the senders issue, The information needed was not supplied. What are they supposed to do make up the Taric codes on import? sorry that is just not done and there is where the issue was.

Daft that it cant be resolved here while IM is dealing with them though.

Also for any one that has a Magazine subscription from the UK a lad has told me An post are looking to collect about a fiver for the pleasure of customs clearing these.

 

 

I think JM mentioned that the An Post system requests a 10 digit TARIC code (looking for the so called TARIC sub-heading perhaps?) despite HS codes generally being 8 digits long, so it throws a silly error if the code is missing some padding/leading zeros or something. The An Post system genuinely seems to be broken or at best extremely fragile and error prone:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TARIC_code

Here's our own favourite product:

https://www.tariffnumber.com/2021/95030030

I would (and so would any normal human) fill in 95030030 when asked for the TARIC/HS code. That's the number on Hattons parcels too and the number that I've had on stuff from Switzerland. But from what JM was saying the An Post system requires 10 digits to be entered so seems to be looking for stuff that is not normally included.

I have not seen the need for the TARIC sub headings on any parcels I have received. I've only ever seen the 8 digit HS code.

In any case, there needs to be a fallback as exists elsewhere, so that parcels aren't returned to the other side of the world for missing paperwork. In fact the German customs do indeed assign a TARIC code by inspecting the item if it comes with no paperwork (rare that there is no paperwork at all to help tell them what it is they are looking at I guess).

The magazines thing is just bizarre.

[BosKonay]

95030030 is the HS code on all of our items and we ship without problems but then we are also dispatching both in the UK and EU depending on the customers location. 

[skinner75]

1 hour ago, Georgeconna said:

Also for any one that has a Magazine subscription from the UK a lad has told me An post are looking to collect about a fiver for the pleasure of customs clearing these.

 

  I'm glad I cancelled all my magazine subs last year so!

Brexit - the gift that keeps on giving...

They'll be putting sawdust in the bread soon - mark my words

[irishmail]

1 hour ago, Georgeconna said:

"as long as the item is sent with the correct customs information there would be no issues with the item coming in"

sorry but this is the senders issue, The information needed was not supplied. What are they supposed to do make up the Taric codes on import? sorry that is just not done and there is where the issue was.

Daft that it cant be resolved here while IM is dealing with them though.

Also for any one that has a Magazine subscription from the UK a lad has told me An post are looking to collect about a fiver for the pleasure of customs clearing these.

 

 

So every individual will need to know the the Taric codes for any gifts they send in future!   He clearly put on the packet what the contents were and vale £20.00.  I thought that the codes were more for business's sending abroad rather then individuals sending to friends and family. Going to be fun sending and receiving parcels this coming Christmas.

[irishmail]

1 hour ago, declan64 said:

Hattons have requested I pay DHL and they will refund me. The package is out for delivery today - the man in the DHL van even texted me.

I've paid DHL now and I assume Hattons will do the needful. I've still asked them what has gone wrong here as I haven't had this problem before.

I do use Marks and if I was local in Dublin I'd probably use them more.

With eBay from UK sellers no longer an economical option since Brexit I do find pre-owned stuff from Hattons that I simply couldn't find anywhere else (apart from eBay) not to mention their broader range than Marks.
The trunk service is also really handy to keep shipping costs down.

With the recent price inflation in the UK, Marks are actually very competitive now so well worth going to if you can find what you are looking for.

Just out of curiosity, understand if you don't want to into full details, was you order below the £135/€150 limit and did the £15.00 DHL delivery push it over that amount which 'may' have triggered the customs.  Anyway good that Hatton's are sorting it.

[Tarabuses]

As an interesting aside, my sister in law ordered a €200 gift voucher from IKEA not realising it would be sent from the UK.  She duly received a request from An Post for €52 before the voucher could be delivered.   She refused to pay and contacted IKEA who cancelled the voucher and refunded the €200. Two days letter An Post delivered the voucher despite having received no payment.

I had advised her that there was no VAT or duty on gift vouchers as they were effectively cash.  Revenue have since confirmed I was correct.  Obviously An Post also realised that at some stage too and so released the voucher, but too late as it was now cancelled.

It is hard to believe that the state agency reponsible for delivering our post is so incompetent.

  

[jhb171achill]

52 minutes ago, Tarabuses said:

As an interesting aside, my sister in law ordered a €200 gift voucher from IKEA not realising it would be sent from the UK.  She duly received a request from An Post for €52 before the voucher could be delivered.   She refused to pay and contacted IKEA who cancelled the voucher and refunded the €200. Two days letter An Post delivered the voucher despite having received no payment.

I had advised her that there was no VAT or duty on gift vouchers as they were effectively cash.  Revenue have since confirmed I was correct.  Obviously An Post also realised that at some stage too and so released the voucher, but too late as it was now cancelled.

It is hard to believe that the state agency reponsible for delivering our post is so incompetent.

  

That it truly, utterly DISGRACEFUL. One for Joe Duffy, in all actual seriousness.

[irishmail]

It just gets better.  Yesterday the anpsot agent told me that it was scanned Tuesday night to be returned, I went to check to see if it was yet sent back and now today at 17:06 it is still in Dublin sitting there since Monday!!! So the Anpost agent was telling me a load of $$$$.  This was a sent as a gift from a family member.  Christmas and Birthdays will be fun.   

23 September 2021 17:06

Customs clearance have identified a problem with the customs declaration accompanying your item. As such, the item must be returned to the sender.

21 September 2021 22:42

We could not deliver your post. We will try to return it to the sender.

20 September 2021 13:19

Your delivery has been sorted DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

20 September 2021 13:18

We have your post in DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

20 September 2021 13:17

Your delivery was received by An Post in DUBLIN MAIL CENTRE, DUBLIN 12

[Mayner]

8 hours ago, BosKonay said:

95030030 is the HS code on all of our items and we ship without problems but then we are also dispatching both in the UK and EU depending on the customers location. 

 

Recent e-mail from my NZ Post account manager indicates that An Post require a 10 digit TARIC code to clear an Item through Irish Customs, although the EU TARIC look up site shows an 8 digit code

The example is a  kit that An Post claim was rejected as a result of issues with the electronic customs declaration.

 

"Hi John,

 

We've had feedback on advice for Ireland bound shipments going forward. Please see this below. 

 1. Descriptions to have spaces between words. '/' is not an ideal word separator.

 

 

 

 2. The tariff item to be entered is the 10-digit taric code for EU destined items.

 

For example, 95030030 could be 9503003000 however, to be clear, this is not being provided as tariff advice, it is an example. It is the sender's responsibility for providing the correct taric information.

 

It might be worth raising the issue on an RTE consumer affairs problem especially as its coming up to Christmas. A phone call or programme on gifts from family in the UK and children's toys being delayed because of An Post bureaucracy is certain to stir public interest. 

 

Edited September 23, 2021 by Mayner

[jhb171achill]

This is light years beyond farcical, and totally unacceptable.

Let's see what happens with MY recent order for stuff from Noo Zealand! What sort of mess will An Post make of it!

Anything I order in the Republic of Brexitstan I get delivered to my daughter in Walesland..... so that's ONE solution....

[amdaley]

I've been told that the matter has been sent as a parliamentary question To ask the Minister for Environment, Climate and Communications if he will investigate issues arising between An Post and Revenue related to the calculation and collection of vat and duties on parcels, and the steps he will take to establish a clear process for handling such issues that avoids parcels being returned to the originator, and if he will make a statement on the matter.

I won't be holding my breath but some good might come from it if only to highlight the problem.