Class A

[richrua]

I like the Silver fox models . Affordable and handy. This is another option for power. thanks.

[enniscorthyman]

Looks like a great option for a better

running C class

[burnthebox]

Hi Dave

 

Yes, it will be available as a kit or RTR, made to order for those interested, the chassis design will fit (with adjustments) the Class A, B, C & 121- all projects on the design workbench!!

 

Will I put you down for 10 Class A units??

 

Eoin

Hi Eoin, would this include DCC

Thanks

Paul

[murrayec]

Hi Eoin, would this include DCC

Thanks

Paul

 

Hi Paul

 

Yes both flavours will be available, the spud motors have to have the internal pick-up removed and the motor wired for DCC- I do this if required.

 

Some shots of the 'C' ECMCHAS! coming together;-

 

 

 

 

A few wires and a little fettling on the buffer beam and off to the test track

 

Eoin

[Noel]

I've re-read this excellent thread again with interest. It begs a question:

 

Does anybody have a video of an A or C class demonstrating the chassis starting, low speed creep, stopping, and crawling over point work?

 

The videos on the thread show A/C class models already running at speed. What I would like to see is a video of a chassis that has proven its smoothness and crawlability starting off. Ability to haul a load once moving is great, but how smooth can some of these chassis be starting and stopping slowly? I'm not sure a 15:1 gear ratio can do this, but I could be mislead. Bachmann chassis have much higher gear ratio which is why they perform in such a scale like manner.

 

Reason is, I am keen to get, acquire, build, or commission a few C and A class models, but only if I can get them running on quality performing chassis.

 

Has anybody tried the Athearn SW1500 chassis with a SF C class kit?

 

Thanks in advance.

[enniscorthyman]

Noel,I posted up a video of my 001

With sound chip and the Deltic chassis

a good while ago showing slow speeds.

I don't know if it's any help.

[Noel]

Noel,I posted up a video of my 001

With sound chip and the Deltic chassis

a good while ago showing slow speeds.

I don't know if it's any help.

 

Thanks. I will have a look at that. Did it have coverage of train starting off and stopping?

[irishthump]

I've re-read this excellent thread again with interest. It begs a question:

 

Does anybody have a video of an A or C class demonstrating the chassis starting, low speed creep, stopping, and crawling over point work?

 

The videos on the thread show A/C class models already running at speed. What I would like to see is a video of a chassis that has proven its smoothness and crawlability starting off. Ability to haul a load once moving is great, but how smooth can some of these chassis be starting and stopping slowly? I'm not sure a 15:1 gear ratio can do this, but I could be mislead. Bachmann chassis have much higher gear ratio which is why they perform in such a scale like manner.

 

Reason is, I am keen to get, acquire, build, or commission a few C and A class models, but only if I can get them running on quality performing chassis.

 

Has anybody tried the Athearn SW1500 chassis with a SF C class kit?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

To be honest I doubt if you will get great smooth slow running from those Hornby Deltic chassis'.

 

I recently cobbled together a chassis from spare ho parts. It uses an Athearn frame, Atlas bogies and a Walthers Proto motor and is a very smooth runner. Here's a link to the workbench thread - http://irishrailwaymodeller.com/showthread.php/77-Graham-s-Workbench?p=74181&viewfull=1#post74181

[Dave]

Have a look at Eoins chassis, it runs like a dream with nice slow running. Including a working fan, directional fibre optic lighting. Well worth a look.

[Weshty]

Have a look at Eoins chassis, it runs like a dream with nice slow running. Including a working fan, directional fibre optic lighting. Well worth a look.

 

+1. I've had the pleasure of seeing it work and held it as well. A very tasty job done with it.

[Noel]

+1. I've had the pleasure of seeing it work and held it as well. A very tasty job done with it.

 

Thanks, sounds promising. Are there any videos of slow running, starting and stopping, and most importantly of all crawling over points?

[Noel]

To be honest I doubt if you will get great smooth slow running from those Hornby Deltic chassis'.

 

I recently cobbled together a chassis from spare ho parts. It uses an Athearn frame, Atlas bogies and a Walthers Proto motor and is a very smooth runner. Here's a link to the workbench thread - http://irishrailwaymodeller.com/showthread.php/77-Graham-s-Workbench?p=74181&viewfull=1#post74181

 

Thanks IT, thats exactly what I was looking for. That thread is very helpful especially the video.

[enniscorthyman]

Thanks. I will have a look at that. Did it have coverage of train starting off and stopping?

 

If you go to youtube and search for

Irish loco with sound,you will see a

Video of 001 class loco with sound.

Some slow running on it.

[Noel]

If you go to youtube and search for

Irish loco with sound,you will see a

Video of 001 class loco with sound.

Some slow running on it.

 

Found it thanks. Was that with the 'railroad' deltic chassis (i.e. same as St Paddy)? I have one of those and not madly impressed with it. Its not awful, but nowhere near as good as a bachmann chassis for ultra slow running.

 

How do folk buy these chassis? eBay and through the body away, or can the chassis be bought on its own? I've wondered about using a Bachmann class 25 bo-bo chassis which seems a perfect fit for the SF body steel, but possibly use co-co bogies from a Bachmann class 37

[Riversuir226]

Buy the loco and sell the body to the uk market, the class 25 is a bit too long for the c class. The biggest problem is the small gap between the bogies as this is where the motor would go. Bachmann co cos such as the cl 55/37 are way too long for the a class due to the same problem as the c class.

[murrayec]

Thanks, sounds promising. Are there any videos of slow running, starting and stopping, and most importantly of all crawling over points?

 

Hi Noel

 

A video here;

 

http://irishrailwaymodeller.com/showthread.php/4121-Class-C-ECMCHAS-For-Silver-Fox-Kit?p=79227&viewfull=1#post79227

 

also slow running vid at start of the above thread

 

Eoin

[Noel]

Hi Noel

 

A video here;

 

http://irishrailwaymodeller.com/showthread.php/4121-Class-C-ECMCHAS-For-Silver-Fox-Kit?p=79227&viewfull=1#post79227

 

also slow running vid at start of the above thread

 

Eoin

 

Thanks Eoin, but the clips below are a examples of what I meant by slow running as opposed to low speeds. I am trying to find a chassis solution for A and C class that will get at least somewhere close to this level of smoothness during slow manoevering operations (e.g. shunting, coupling, runarounds, starting off, stopping at station platforms, etc). I know Hornby chassis just cannot achieve this, but the likes of Bachmann and Athearn, etc, can. Gearing ratios and flywheels as well as all wheel or near all wheel drive and pickups seem to help this (i.e. and avoid unrealistic scale start speeds of 15-20mph).

 

Smooth low speed crawl with no hesitation nor jerking. MM/Bachmann chassis are incredibly smooth over insulfrog paintwork at crawl speeds.

 

Smooth slow speed operation over paintwork, stop and start (I think this is one of Stephens clips)

 

PS: I know the 181 in the 1st clip is going unrealistically slow, except if simulating starting off with a very heavy load, but the 071 is close to scale.

Edited November 23, 2015 by Noel

[Barl]

The Class 55 railroad chassis surprised me if I'm honest, it runs very smoothly for a single bogie drive unit. I've included a video below from a while back of my 001 (A) class with a deltic chassis which shows some slow running while pulling 5 mk3 coaches.

 

Edit: I'm not sure if this link is working but I'll try fix it tomorrow at some point.

 

http://vid637.photobucket.com/albums/uu97/Barl07/Video0056.mp4 ii

Edited November 25, 2015 by Barl

[Noel]

The Class 55 railroad chassis surprised me if I'm honest, it runs very smoothly for a single bogie drive unit. I've included a video below from a while back of my 001 (A) class with a deltic chassis which shows some slow running while pulling 5 mk3 coaches.

 

Edit: I'm not sure if this link is working but I'll try fix it tomorrow at some point.

 

http://vid637.photobucket.com/albums/uu97/Barl07/Video0056.mp4 ii

 

Thanks Barl, that's exactly the sort of video evidence I was looking for that demonstrates slow operations. I have to say watching that I'm impressed with the hornby 55. Is that the 'St Paddy' chassis? I have a hornby class 52 chassis under my sole A class but it can't perform as well as your example. Hmmm food for thought.

[DiveController]

The Class 55 railroad chassis surprised me if I'm honest, it runs very smoothly for a single bogie drive unit. I've included a video below from a while back of my 001 (A) class with a deltic chassis which shows some slow running while pulling 5 mk3 coaches.

 

Edit: I'm not sure if this link is working but I'll try fix it tomorrow at some point.

 

http://vid637.photobucket.com/albums/uu97/Barl07/Video0056.mp4 ii

 

Been watching this thread also. Video is working fine. Like Noel, I was similarly impressed when I saw it earlier and relatively easy to come by that chassis, I think.

[Noel]

My hornby class 52 chassis is jerky at low speed and often lurches to a start. See a few segments of the video clip below. It's not hediously jerky, sometimes runs smooth for a few inches and then hesitates or skips forward (ie like a stiff axel).

 

• 1st minute jerky at crawl speeds
  
• 02m15s compare jerky A v smooth MM
  
• 04m30s lurches to a start
  

 

[video=youtube_share;bUt_QO-Jnu8]

 

If the class 55 chassis improves this I might give it a try for another A, but still need to find a chassis for a C class.

 

PS: This clip was with a lenz silver+ decoder, it was far worse with the hornby decoder which I had to replace.

Edited November 25, 2015 by Noel

[Barl]

Noel, yes the chassis is from the railroad St. Paddy model. As space is a bit tight it was a matter of squeezing the weight in wherever possible.

 

I tried a few decoders with mine, including a Bachmann and TCS one. I damaged the built in decoder socket during construction, so decided to hardwire a cheap Hornby decoder in for testing the model; I actually found this to work the best with the 55 despite the warnings I had heard about them. This is what is fitted in the video above.

[Junctionmad]

Slow speed or crawl speed running is not magic, it just needs a few key ingredients that have been missing from many rtr models

 

It's NOT a function of number of driven axles , that more related to overall haulage capacity.

 

Primarily it's about gearing and electrical continuity and not about centre drives for example

 

Electrical continuity requires reliable all wheel pickups , which gives diesels a huge advantage over other model engines. The best pickup method , favoured in the USA. Is split axle pickups.

 

Then you need to keep all wheels in contact with the track , either by faultless track or wheel compensation or springing.

 

Where you have poorer motors , 3-5 poles etc, " clogging" is an issue at low speed. The best way round that is sufficiently high gear ratios to ensure the motor is turning reliably while the ground speed is slow. 2 stage gearboxes etc.

 

There are other aspects of the system design that help , electro frogs , larger mass , slower turning motors ( which tend to favour centre dives ) flywheels , keep-alives.

 

DCC is also much better at promoting slow running as the full track power is always available

 

Any decent scratch builder can fabricate a chassis that outperforms rtr. It's all a matter of time. Alternatively buy one from hollywodfoundry !!

[Noel]

Primarily it's about gearing and electrical continuity and not about centre drives for example

 

Thanks Dave.

 

Precisely - Bachmann centre drive chassis seem to provide all the merits you mention (i.e. gearing, electrical continuity, etc). In addition they have four powered axils over two bogies.

Edited November 25, 2015 by Noel

[Noel]

I have an A class with a Hornby class 52 chassis (see video above), but it moves like a rusty door hinge and I'm feed up with its poor running quality. The "2ft rule" may help hiding lack of scale detail on some models, but the "2ft rule" cannot hide poor low speed running, not from any viewing distance. It's awful shunting.

 

Has anybody managed to successfully fit an RTR centre drive chassis into an A class such as Richie's suggestion of an Altas RSD4/5 or other Bachmann, newer Hornby, Athearn, etc, and if so did it run well at crawl speeds?

[Riversuir226]

http://www.wellsgreen-tmd.co.uk/omwbjune06.htm

Noel, take a look at this lads work hes been doing this kinda stuff for a good few years.

For the c class the nearest uk loco in model form in terms of length is the class 16 which heljan have done in rtr in the past.

Edited November 30, 2015 by Riversuir226

[Mayner]

I have an A class with a Hornby class 52 chassis (see video above), but it moves like a rusty door hinge and I'm feed up with its poor running quality. The "2ft rule" may help hiding lack of scale detail on some models, but the "2ft rule" cannot hide poor low speed running, not from any viewing distance. It's awful shunting.

 

Has anybody managed to successfully fit an RTR centre drive chassis into an A class such as Richie's suggestion of an Altas RSD4/5 or other Bachmann, newer Hornby, Athearn, etc, and if so did it run well at crawl speeds?

 

Years ago I motorised a MIR A Class using the trucks, motor and drive shafts from an Athearn SD9 mounted on a chassis built from KS brass section, I shortened the drive to fit in the A Class by removing one of the flywheels.

 

The RSD 4-5 is shorter than an SD9 and the trucks unequal axle spacings similar to the A Class