Irish Rail freight trial

[MOGUL]

Hello to all,

 

Just thought I would share the details of this coming Monday's freight trial in case any camera toting members of the IRM community wanted to head out and catch it!

 

The train will operate from Dublin to Ballina, not Waterford to Limerick as originally planned. The reason for the change was the low height of bridges on the south tipp line making the use of 9ft 6in containers impossible.. As the port of waterford only handles short sea services, the only cobtainers readily available were of the 9ft 6 variety..

 

The train will load in Dublin port on Monday afternoon to form the 20:40 departure ex North wall. The train will run as 27 wagons as far as Claremorris, where 9 wagons will be detached for the run onwards to Ballina..

 

Hope that this is of help to some and happy snapping!

 

Mogul

[StevieB]

This is all looking very positive. Is this why an additional siding was laid in at Claremorris.

From a photographic point of view it presents a few challenges - look forward to seeing the results.

 

Stephen

[MOGUL]

Hi Stephen,

 

I think the thinking behind the extra siding was to accommodate some of the overflow from Ballina yard at busy times.. Up until about 6 months ago, the spare iWT set was stored in Claremorris from Thursday evening until the following Tuesday morning.. Funnily enough this stopped around the time the siding was installed! But it will still get some use, particularly if the biomass does go by rail or if Claremorris starts to handle freight again

[Warbonnet]

Thanks for the tip off Mogul!

[MOGUL]

Thanks Fran,

 

Looking forward to your effort!

[Mayner]

Interesting piece in a recent Trains magazine some American Class 1 railroads are increasing train lengths to 250 cars with distributed power in order to remain profitable in present US economic conditions.

 

27 bogies is a step in the right direction, does anyone know if any of the locos are re-geared of fitted with traction control equipment to limit wheel slip

[Railer]

The 201s have creep control as is but it's hardly ever used. These trails are well within a 201's tonnage limits, they used to haul 1,000 ton cement trains from Dublin to COrk along with 071s in the boom times. But liners were limited to around 740 tons with the old DFDS liners being the heaviest. The tonnage trail with the autoballasters was over 2,200 tons and the 201 locos were not even close to being maxed out.

[hurricanemk1c]

The HOBS trial recently was only 1300 tonnes not over 2200 tonnes. Class 66's in the UK (geared for 75mph not 100mph, so more suited) start to struggle over 1700 tonnes. Geared for 60 they can just get up to 2000

[Railer]

I thought it was over 2000 for some reason:confused:

 

Without creep and wheel slip control the 071s can struggle with tara trains at times in the rain so it looks like these 54teu freights will stay 201 hauled.

 

Edited June 25, 2016 by Railer

[MOGUL]

I think the Tara's will still be the heaviest trains on a regular basis at 900 tonnes trailing weight(12 x 75 tonne wagons)..

 

Even if the container trial ran with every single wagon loaded at 40 tonnes( 2 laden 20ft containers per wagon) it would only be 1080 tonnes so should be well within the capacity of an 071 or a 201... Likelihood is that the train will carry a mixture of laden 20ft bulk tanks( 30 tonnes each), 20ft imports ( 2 per wagon at 20 tonnes each), 40ft imports (24-26 Tonnes each) and empty containers ( 3-4 Tonnes each)..

 

Did cement trains ever run at 1000 tonnes? I thought 900 would be the max made up of 12 Bogies or 24 Bubbles

[Railer]

Did cement trains ever run at 1000 tonnes? I thought 900 would be the max made up of 12 Bogies or 24 Bubbles

 

I have a copy of the Irish Rail Working Timetabe 11th Dec 05- 9th Dec '06. In it it sates that all liners are limited to 780 tons at 36 TEU max. Exceptions being 1,000 ton cement trains only to be hauled by 071 or 201 class. (2x 141/181) not permitted. The 1,000 tons train are only permitted with special permission between Platin and Northwall and Northwall to Cork.

 

I don't see anything in it about Tara Mine train weight limits other than the max weight of a laden wagon is 75 tons.

Actually just found it, max tara weight limit of 12 wagons is 942 tons.

 

Cement trains were 900 max, the 1,000 limit was worst case with a dead loco in tow if needs be.

Edited June 25, 2016 by Railer

[hurricanemk1c]

With the re-engining of the 201's near certain now, and Dublin Port remodelling the Tara Mines reception area (removing the length issue of the traverser there), I'd say a lot more freight will go 201 only. I think it has been said elsewhere that these longer freight flows will be 201 only as they are surer footed than the 071s

[Railer]

Leaves the question of what will become of the 071s, 10 has been overhauled and rebuilt so far plus they are all getting or have at this stage new electronic brake mods.

 

Didn't know anything was happening with the tara terminal, always figured if they really wanted a 201 could just propel the train down the tramway to unload, that would mean the 201 has no need for the traverser and just shunt and haul back as normal.

[jhb171achill]

Cue a bid from the ITG for one.....????

[Railer]

Cue a bid from the ITG for one.....????

 

No bidding needed depending on the case at the time. They got 124 for a symbolic €1, Irish Rail didn't charge them for it, but they had to pay for it's removal from Inchicore and transport costs to their site.

[Mayner]

Indo article on IE plans to run longer freight trains http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/freight-trains-almost-half-a-kilometre-long-set-to-enter-service-34842434.html

[jhb171achill]

As recently as the 1970s, a single 121 could be seen taking empty cattle wagons from Dublin to Mullingar after a fair, and after being washed out. This regularly loaded to 70 four wheelers and two brake vans.

 

Is IE's much-publicised long train as long as this, or longer?

 

By USA standards, incidentally, it's about a fifth the size of some "normal" trains!

[spudfan]

http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/freight/single-view/view/iarnrod-eireann-tests-longer-freight-trains.html

[Railer]

As recently as the 1970s, a single 121 could be seen taking empty cattle wagons from Dublin to Mullingar after a fair, and after being washed out. This regularly loaded to 70 four wheelers and two brake vans.

 

Is IE's much-publicised long train as long as this, or longer?

 

By USA standards, incidentally, it's about a fifth the size of some "normal" trains!

 

70 20-22ft wagons would be longer then the 27 wagon trial that was made up of a mix of 42 and 47ft wagons by at least 60 meters. The trial train was reportedly 440 meters long. 70 cattle wagons would be around 500 meters.

[MOGUL]

The next freight trial will take place next Wednesday, 26th April 2017.. 24 flat wagons running as 20:45 North Wall to Ballina.. The trial will operate as 24 wagons in the down direction only, with the train returning as two halfs on Thursday and Friday..

 

To facilitate the trial, the CPWs will commence operating on the DFDS liner this Thursday

[ttc0169]

The next freight trial will take place next Wednesday, 26th April 2017.. 24 flat wagons running as 20:45 North Wall to Ballina.. The trial will operate as 24 wagons in the down direction only, with the train returning as two halfs on Thursday and Friday..

 

To facilitate the trial, the CPWs will commence operating on the DFDS liner this Thursday

This freight trial has been cancelled.

[MOGUL]

Yup just heard, driver shortage.. hopefully in the next few weeks

[MOGUL]

Trial is now scheduled to run on Sunday 18/06.. 24 wagons dublin to Ballina only

[thewanderer]

Wednesday 14th June 2017:

Further trials for the lengthening of freight trains are being carried out this week. The first trial was a 14 wagon laden timber train from Waterford to Carlow & return which operated with 232. I popped over to Co. Carlow to see it along with the DFDS liner from Waterford to Ballina which was worked by 079. A trial of the IWT liner with 24 wagons is scheduled for Sunday morning.

 

Click http://smu.gs/2rsn2WO to view.

 

[Noel]

With the new motorway network is it not less expensive for companies to transport containers directly by road point to point using HGVs?

[Glenderg]

With the new motorway network is it not less expensive for companies to transport containers directly by road point to point using HGVs?

 

Nothing to do with roads. All to do with carbon footprint and big fines from the EU. It's in our interest to get more heavy freight onto rails, rather than roads.

[Mayner]

Nothing to do with roads. All to do with carbon footprint and big fines from the EU. It's in our interest to get more heavy freight onto rails, rather than roads.

 

Threats of Ireland being fined by the EU for carbon emissions is something of a red herring. The European Emissions Trading Scheme is part of an international trading scheme that allows big energy users to buy and sell carbon credits or a license to pollute.

 

Coca-Cola and other big international shippers that use the IWT & DFDS container service have admitted that they use rail because of the lower carbon cost to their business.

 

Apart from Coillte, Tara & possibly Irish Cement there are few other shippers that could use rail to farm carbon credits.

 

I am not sure whether buying carbon offsets and carbon farming reminds me more of selling indulgences or the South Sea Bubble.

 

Regardless of the carbon trading scheme or the treat of EU fines its difficult to see a swing back to railfreight in a small island like Ireland with little or no heavy manufacturing industry and apart from Ballina most manufacturing and process industry within 40-50 miles of a deep sea port.

Edited June 15, 2017 by Mayner

[Noel]

Nothing to do with roads. All to do with carbon footprint and big fines from the EU. It's in our interest to get more heavy freight onto rails, rather than roads.

 

Ok, but our freight trains are "diesel" powered, rather than electric, so I can't see much of a difference in CO2 footprint moving say 14 containers from a shipping port to 14 different end point destinations, especially when the geographic distances are relatively short. Road option is also probably faster delivery point to point.

[irishthump]

Ok, but our freight trains are "diesel" powered, rather than electric, so I can't see much of a difference in CO2 footprint moving say 14 containers from a shipping port to 14 different end point destinations, especially when the geographic distances are relatively short. Road option is also probably faster delivery point to point.

 

Rail is the most efficient way to move freight. One 201 class loco might be pumping out a lot of diesel fumes but the amount of trucks needed to move the equivalent amount of tonnage would be far worse.

[Weshty]

Rail is the most efficient way to move freight. One 201 class loco might be pumping out a lot of diesel fumes but the amount of trucks needed to move the equivalent amount of tonnage would be far worse.

 

Reduced emissions

less wear and tear of the road system (18 wheelers can seriously age a road undersurface)

safer travel with reduced risk of Road Traffic Accidents

[irishthump]

Reduced emissions

less wear and tear of the road system (18 wheelers can seriously age a road undersurface)

safer travel with reduced risk of Road Traffic Accidents

 

And they won't be clogging up the f*cking M50 at rush hour, which is from 9am-7pm in this country!

[Noel]

Sure I understand that, but what about the commercial cost difference between point to point delivery (a single delivery leg) on a small geographical island, verses point to rail to point (i.e. three delivery legs)?

 

BTW, personally I'd prefer to see more freight by rail than road, but wonder if road is more efficient and less expensive for businesses.

 

Has electrification of mainline rail been considered and costed in recent decades?

[jhb171achill]

Sure I understand that, but what about the commercial cost difference between point to point delivery (a single delivery leg) on a small geographical island, verses point to rail to point (i.e. three delivery legs)?

 

BTW, personally I'd prefer to see more freight by rail than road, but wonder if road is more efficient and less expensive for businesses.

 

Has electrification of mainline rail been considered and costed in recent decades?

 

 

Particularly with Leo in charge now, these are matters which deserve serious attention.

[MOGUL]

I'd be blue in the face if I responded to all the posts like this one Noel but yes rail is commercially viable for its current uses and probably also a few more flows I can think of

[Mayner]

Sure I understand that, but what about the commercial cost difference between point to point delivery (a single delivery leg) on a small geographical island, verses point to rail to point (i.e. three delivery legs)?

 

BTW, personally I'd prefer to see more freight by rail than road, but wonder if road is more efficient and less expensive for businesses.

 

Has electrification of mainline rail been considered and costed in recent decades?

 

Road tends to be more cost efficient faster and flexible for less than train load lots. The road transport system has the advantage of being a user pays system where the Government and Insurance companies can adjust fuel, vehicle and road user excise taxes and insurance fees to recover the full internal and external costs of road transport.

 

Another big pro in favour of road transport in Ireland is that you can load a truck with butter or cheese at a Co-Op in Cork or Kerry and deliver direct to a supermarket in the UK or main land Europe.

 

Road vehicle technology is also jumping ahead of rail, with larger more fuel efficient vehicles (HPMV) and GPS based fleet management systems improving roads competitive advantage over rail.

 

https://www.nzta.govt.nz/vehicles/vehicle-types/vehicle-classes-and-standards/vehicle-dimensions-and-mass/high-productivity-motor-vehicles/

Edited June 15, 2017 by Mayner