Proposal ref GSR 2-6-0, 461

[Mike 84C]

Have any of you guys seen this site? Flexiscale they do laser scanning and rapid prototyping and are working on a kit for one of the Festiniog Rly England 0-4-0"s. I have set up a proposal for GSR No 461, if enough support is there we could get a kit at a reasonable cost and time frame.

I also tried to find what criteria is used for production of more obscure British Prototypes,from a couple of retailers with no success, so this may be a way forward.

[Garfield]

Link: http://www.flexiscale.co

[Kirley]

Tried to find your proposal Mike on the Flexiscale site without success.

[heirflick]

great idea and i would support it 100% but as with kirley, i cant find your proposal either!

[Riversuir226]

Yes please

[Mike 84C]

I accessed Flexiscale through my wifes facebook a/c. All the access info is on the toolbar, the Proposals button tells how it all works and shows what is currently active. 461 is still a private proposal awaiting approval. After which we can put our full weight behind it. I do hope I picked a subject with a wide acceptance.

You can also see how many modellers are backing each proposal and as some have only a very few I am hopeful for 461.

Mike.

[Guest hidden-agenda]

Looks like a Shapeway set-up but a bit more model railway orientated. I like the Welsh slate mine loco. http://shop.flexiscale.co/collections/frontpage/products/penrhyn-quarry-port-class-winifred The £200.00 price tag for the Welsh kit would put me off getting a kit of an Irish loco as its a lot bigger and would beg the question is it better to wait for somebody to do a brass kit? 461 is a tender loco and i have a feeling the cost would come in around £450.00 sterling ( with-out wheels and motor) with these guys and are they willing to come over and laser scan the loco? it could be a success if enough people were willing to shell out but some how i think the cost would out weigh the waiting option for me any way.

[Warbonnet]

Heljan are to do a RTR 009 loco, a 2-6-2 I believe. Could this be of any use to Irish narrow gauge modellers, even as a chassis donor?

[minister_for_hardship]

Heljan are to do a RTR 009 loco, a 2-6-2 I believe. Could this be of any use to Irish narrow gauge modellers, even as a chassis donor?

 

The rumour mill has it that they may be Lynton & Barnstaple locos.

Might suit a T&DLR no 5 or lop off the pony truck for the 2-6-0 sisters. Don't know how they'd compare dimensions-wise.

.

[Broithe]

The rumour mill has it that they may be Lynton & Barnstaple locos.

 

And Peco are launching an 00-9 rolling stock range - http://www.peco-uk.com/page.asp?id=009wagon ..

[Warbonnet]

The rumour mill has it that they may be Lynton & Barnstaple locos.

Might suit a T&DLR no 5 or lop off the pony truck for the 2-6-0 sisters. Don't know how they'd compare dimensions-wise.

.

 

Yep, confirmed in Railway Modeller as L&B http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/68054-ready-to-run-oo9-loco-from-heljan/#entry942457

[Kirley]

461 is a tender loco and i have a feeling the cost would come in around £450.00 sterling ( with-out wheels and motor) with these guys and are they willing to come over and laser scan the loco? it could be a success if enough people were willing to shell out but some how i think the cost would out weigh the waiting option for me any way.

 

I agree Gareth that level of cost would be prohititive but in the meantime I still would express an interest just to see how prices work out.

[colmflanagan]

The model Heljan is proposing idindeed a Lynton & Barnstaple 2-6-2 tank - not really terribly like any Irish loco I can think of, but a pretty model nonetheless. I have one and will post a picture later -maybe someone may see an application for it!

[Mike 84C]

Thanks for all the input and so quickly posted;so there is interest in that loco? I agree that cost may make it a nonstarter but if the question isnt asked we will never know. And how long will we wait for an etched kit? maybe it will happen if enough interest is shown here. I will post if I get more info; from Flexiscale.

Mike

[Garfield]

I'd strongly recommend that only those who would definitely buy a model of 461 should vote for it (difficult to confirm when a price isn't available, I know), because the flipside of Flexiscale's business model is that if they receive a lot of votes for something because the link is posted on a forum, and then only a small number of people actually buy the kit when it's made available, they'll be reluctant to produce anything similar in future (i.e. Irish models). In a worst-case scenario, it could even put the company out of business.

[Mike 84C]

Recieved these comments from Flexiscale, now its up to us. The Flexiscale Co 25 February 19:55:

 

Sorry there were problems there and I think you're right it does have a very wide appeal. We've now approved it (having worked for a long while in the online industry I know that systems without approval are always abused sooner or later), sorry this took a while, for some reason we didn't get the message there was a new project there.

 

We've now made it one of our featured projects.

 

Thanks so much for suggesting it, I think it's a great plan. You can now publicise the link on

 

http://www.facebook.com/l/SAQGl3rGTAQEFoEaesH30eOUtWW3d_0SEwmThbGsry1TS7Q/projects.flexiscale.co/project/62/great-southern-railway-2-6-0-no-461

[David]

I'd consider doing a brass kit version. Would there be interest in that? I'd be willing to do it if there were orders for a first batch of about 20-30 kits. RTR version would be available too.

[Glenderg]

I've spent a lot of time looking at their proposals and frankly I cannot see how it adds up, but fair dues Mike for having a go.

 

First off, the high resolution scanning. I've priced this for conservation survey work in the 9-5 world, and you'd normally get a 500mm resolution point cloud for about 5000 euro, no good for this type of work. I know that 5mm resolution can cost upward of 40,000, and that most of the cost is spent on converting the point cloud to usable data for a 3d model, so I'm not really sure how their sums add up. Second, you'd have to pay their flights, bed and board for the duration of the stay. And flexiscale don't scan the model, it's their partner company who make their living scanning oil rigs - where the sums make sense. You could cut out all that nonsense if you did all the measuring and CAD work yourselves.

 

While I applaud their efforts, they are producing a Shapeways/makerbot/i-materialise model and selling it to you, the only addition being that they've measured it. And cost - £28 for a little slate wagon?

 

We've had the row/chat about the quality of printed stuff, and I cannot see how you can get all that fine rivetted detail of 461, and a lovely glossy painted finish on the boiler with the fine printed grooves and be happy with it. It's asking for a more traditional resin/whitemetal/turned brass approach I would have thought.

 

However, if someone wants to give me bed and board, and a week alone in the summer with 461 I'll do 'ye a super detailed 3d model for free, and all the drawings of to paper yer house. All you need then is somebody to make the mould from it or print it from one of the 3d printer firms. Richie.

[Guest hidden-agenda]

I'd consider doing a brass kit version. Would there be interest in that? I'd be willing to do it if there were orders for a first batch of about 20-30 kits. RTR version would be available too.

 

Any idea of a cost for a kit David as i would not commit and waste your time unless i had some idea ?

[David]

Approx 130 euro excl. wheels and motor.

 

 

Any idea of a cost for a kit David as i would not commit and waste your time unless i had some idea ?

[RedRich]

I know that with steam locos changes are made mechanically and cosmetically in preserved condition. Have any such changes been made to 461 that would dictate as to whether a kit was produced in preservation or as delivered condition. I think Davids and Marks track record with what they have produced so far would be a much better prospect and that is not being disrespectful to Mike. I think Richie's post sums up my own feelings and makes a lot of sense.

 

Rich,

[Mayner]

The Flexiscale funding model appears to be remarkably similar to the FR funding model for the WHR and a lot of its capital programmes.

 

Pledge £1000 and receive a free fully working certified model of Princess. The FR raised about £5m in private sponsorship with gold and silver passes rather than the traditional buy a sleeper appeal.

The Festiniog and Welsh slate lines have a huge following both with enthuiasts and modellers so it might fly.

 

Going by my own experience with rapid prototyping I would agree with Richie and Rich either a simple brass kit or a resin body on a Bachmann 3F chassis would probably be the best bet for a rtr model of 461.

 

It would probably be best to model the loco in its current condition at some stage she received a GSR boiler while 462 worked with her original and larger DSER boiler to the end.

 

Edited February 26, 2013 by Mayner

[RedRich]

Thanks for that John. I was thinking that the loco in her preserved condition would make more sense sales wise.

 

Rich,

[Guest hidden-agenda]

The safe option for those who want a kit or RTR model at a sensible price ( in my opinion) is the offer by David.Its all too easy to put your name to a list and end up being shocked by the price of getting a model made by a company unless you know in advance what your going to pay. As for resin i dont think justice would be done to the model but im open to correction if some one make,s a model of acceptable quality ( beware the posse) so what ever tickles the fancy of others i know what option i am taking.

[gph2000]

Another member once reminded me, that if you are happy with the model that is all that really matters.

 

The key here is to find a format that is most affordable, because it's not like steam outline RTR is spoiled for choice. Some of us are going to have to be dissappointed.

[jhb171achill]

In terms of offering it in preserved condition, this is the same as in later operating condition and would do unless someone wanted to model a 1000% rivet-counting accurate DSER (which, in itself would be awesome!). It could be done in either GSR / CIE grey or the RPSI livery; if the latter, it would be easy for a modeller of an earlier era to repaint into the former! All you'd need is a bucket of grey paint to marinate it in!

[Kirley]

Approx 130 euro excl. wheels and motor.

 

 

David would you consider Maynar’s suggestion of designing your model using a Bachmann Class 3F 0-6-0 chassis? This model is currently on sale at Hattons for £71.23.

 

Thanks Mike for launching this idea.

[David]

David would you consider Maynar’s suggestion of designing your model using a Bachmann Class 3F 0-6-0 chassis? This model is currently on sale at Hattons for £71.23.

 

Thanks Mike for launching this idea.

 

I'd strongly consider using an RTR chassis. It would certainly reduce the building required.

[Mike 84C]

Well guys,Thanks for all your views and comments my only desire was to get a proposal going for a loco I like very much and has the potential for a broad appeal. I am still looking at the Flexiscale option but I think it will sink!! But if David does launch his model of 461, then I"m in that lifeboat so to speak! I dont really want to be faced with a big bill of unknown size for a model so I will speak with backers of the Flexiscale FR proposal whom I know. What other things do we want? so I can propose them and flush otherthings out of the undergrowth!! ;-)

[Horsetan]

Approx 130 euro excl. wheels and motor.

 

I'd be interested if there was provision to build the loco and tender chassis in 21mm gauge, with provision for sprung suspension. Any information about 461's inside motion and cranks would be useful.

[jhb171achill]

I know that with steam locos changes are made mechanically and cosmetically in preserved condition. Have any such changes been made to 461 that would dictate as to whether a kit was produced in preservation or as delivered condition.

Rich,

 

461 as built had a different boiler and chimney. What she carries is as a result of the GSR´s rebuilding of both 461 and her sister 462. Thus, a model "as is" would be appropriate for the GSR or CIE era.

[RedRich]

Thank you John. I'm a diesel era modeller myself but I would like to see a steam loco released to the standard of the MM GM's. Especially one that could be run in a preservation set with Cravens. I often wondered if we would see MM Cravens released in the RPSI blue livery. The orange and black coaches would just need RPSI logos applied to the doors.

 

Rich,

[jhb171achill]

That would look great, RedRich. You could get away with 461 in lined green in that scenario, instead of the less colourful plain dark grey of CIE days!

[Kirley]

I'd consider doing a brass kit version. Would there be interest in that? I'd be willing to do it if there were orders for a first batch of about 20-30 kits. RTR version would be available too.

 

It's now 2 years since this was first launched. It would be nice to have some idea when the project will start, I can appreciate other projects such as the Freight lines overtook it but an update of progress every 3 months or so would I'm sure be appreciated to all who paid deposits.

[David]

It's now 2 years since this was first launched. It would be nice to have some idea when the project will start, I can appreciate other projects such as the Freight lines overtook it but an update of progress every 3 months or so would I'm sure be appreciated to all who paid deposits.

 

Hi Kieran,

 

The project is still on hold to complete the backlog of orders that were placed before it. I'd love to plough on with the 461 project but I think you'd agree that it's only fair that I complete the orders for Enterprise sets and railcars that were placed before the 461 project was committed to. I am however nearing the end of this backlog. The time required in designing and producing hand built models is a very unpredictable so I'd ask for and appreciate your continued patience but rest assured that the project will be completed and to a high standard.