MM0174A

[Davenport]

Hi all,

I received my new MM 141 but when I put it on a test track it makes  noise (see video)  I purchased other models second hand and they

 

 

have decoders in them . I don't know if this noise is this correct? Or is there something wrong with the new model.

Thanks 

[Sean]

I believe its running in DC mode and you need to install a decoder.

 

if your controller has a dc channel it will run on that but beware that the noise is caused by the motor recieving a full track voltage whilst pwm is keeping it stationary and the motors tend to get quite hot as a byproduct of running in this state which can shorten their lives significantly.

 

Most would not recommend it.

[Davenport]

Thanks Sean 

[derek]

23 hours ago, Davenport said:

Hi all,

I received my new MM 141 but when I put it on a test track it makes  noise (see video)  I purchased other models second hand and they

 

have decoders in them . I don't know if this noise is this correct? Or is there something wrong with the new model.

Thanks 

Lads, my new 181 also does not sound right to my ears. Sounds a bit like an old tractor to be honest. And there is a whine above that noise. Not sure you can hear it here.

 

 

[DJ Dangerous]

Are you guys running these with Class 121 decoders or running them on DC layouts or what?

[derek]

2 hours ago, DJ Dangerous said:

Are you guys running these with Class 121 decoders or running them on DC layouts or what?

I am powering the layout with a pair of cheap as chips hornby controllers. Basic as you like. My other 141 ( one I bought from @WRENNEIRE so one of the original run) runs without a glitch. So does my IRM a Class. As does every other loco I run on it. Wonder should I send it back?. I was only running it in this morning....... I wonder if any of the lads from IRM might be able to shed some light on this. @BosKonay or @Garfield ?. I understand that IRM are not responsible for the manufacture of the locos but no harm to ask

Edited April 13 by derek

[Sean]

Personally derek id be handing that back under warranty

[BosKonay]

On 13/4/2024 at 5:10 PM, derek said:

Lads, my new 181 also does not sound right to my ears. Sounds a bit like an old tractor to be honest. And there is a whine above that noise. Not sure you can hear it here.

 

Sounds like a broken gear tooth or definitely something off mechanicaly 

[Davenport]

Hi lads,

I have a digitrak dcs 52 controller with has Dc and Dcc function I have it on Dc and it is making the noise as posted.

[derek]

18 hours ago, BosKonay said:

Sounds like a broken gear tooth or definitely something off mechanicaly 

So do I need to send back the loco or what do I do? I had just about convinced myself to live with it, and said as much to Patrick in an email. But I don't like the sound of broken gear teeth or anything. Running it over time could probably make the problem worse?  It sounds like a kid running a stick across railings. That kind of a rattle. Thanks for the reply. 

Derek

 

[BosKonay]

Maybe send it back and swap it for another to be sure?

[murphaph]

I'd send that back and I am happy to try to fix most things myself. Models should not sound like that out of the box. Something is definitely not right. Send it back now while there are warranty replacements readily available. These things happen unfortunately but that's what the warranty is for

[derek]

Yeah, at this stage the loco is deffo going back. I have emailed  IRM with a view to this, so just waiting for a reply. Thanks for all the replies/advice. If the replacement runs the same, then I will at least know that it is normal. Pain , but what can you do?

Edited April 16 by derek

[derek]

Ok, final update on the noisy loco. Sent it back to IRM and replacement arrived within a couple of days. And to be honest I don't really see any difference between the two. At least now I know that this noise is normal. Just have to live with it. Here is a quick clip of the new one. See what you think.

 

 

[DJ Dangerous]

17 minutes ago, derek said:

Ok, final update on the noisy loco. Sent it back to IRM and replacement arrived within a couple of days. And to be honest I don't really see any difference between the two. At least now I know that this noise is normal. Just have to live with it. Here is a quick clip of the new one. See what you think.

 

 

I think you've just solved a major mystery.

The big jump in price over the 121's was because these are DCC sound fitted, but the factory made a boo boo and installed Class 37 "Tractor" chips by mistake.

[Gabhal Luimnigh]

2 hours ago, derek said:

Ok, final update on the noisy loco. Sent it back to IRM and replacement arrived within a couple of days. And to be honest I don't really see any difference between the two. At least now I know that this noise is normal. Just have to live with it. Here is a quick clip of the new one. See what you think.

 

That noise is not normal Derek, did they send you back the same one?

[ttc0169]

2 hours ago, derek said:

Ok, final update on the noisy loco. Sent it back to IRM and replacement arrived within a couple of days. And to be honest I don't really see any difference between the two. At least now I know that this noise is normal. Just have to live with it. Here is a quick clip of the new one. See what you think.

 

@derek-I recently purchased 174, it’s a normal noise for new locomotives - run in the loco-30 mins in either direction and then remove the bogies and check the amount of lubrication on the gears underneath-I had to put a drop of grease on them,the loco has considerably quietened down since. 

[derek]

 

2 hours ago, DJ Dangerous said:

 

I think you've just solved a major mystery.

The big jump in price over the 121's was because these are DCC sound fitted, but the factory made a boo boo and installed Class 37 "Tractor" chips by mistake.

 

35 minutes ago, Gabhal Luimnigh said:

That noise is not normal Derek, did they send you back the same one?

26 minutes ago, ttc0169 said:

@derek-I recently purchased 174, it’s a normal noise for new locomotives - run in the loco-30 mins in either direction and then remove the bogies and check the amount of lubrication on the gears underneath-I had to put a drop of grease on them,the loco has considerably quietened down since. 

@DJ Dangerous, it sounds like a tractor no mistake. Very disappointing. @Gabhal LuimnighI wouldn't think it's the same loco back again. The "old" one was picked up by courier Friday afternoon and I got a notification same day to say replacement had been released for shipment. Turned up following Tuesday morning(last week). So the turnaround was too quick. And apart from all that, I am 100% sure the lads at IRM wouldn't try such an underhand tactic in the first place.  @ttc0169 I ran the loco in for 60 mins in both directions and this is the result. Bit apprehensive about removing bogies. Is it a big job? Don't want to f**k the loco up entirely. And what type of grease would I use? Thanks Dave, Denis and Noel for the interest

 

[Gabhal Luimnigh]

48 minutes ago, derek said:

 

 

@DJ Dangerous, it sounds like a tractor no mistake. Very disappointing. @Gabhal LuimnighI wouldn't think it's the same loco back again. The "old" one was picked up by courier Friday afternoon and I got a notification same day to say replacement had been released for shipment. Turned up following Tuesday morning(last week). So the turnaround was too quick. And apart from all that, I am 100% sure the lads at IRM wouldn't try such an underhand tactic in the first place.  @ttc0169 I ran the loco in for 60 mins in both directions and this is the result. Bit apprehensive about removing bogies. Is it a big job? Don't want to f**k the loco up entirely. And what type of grease would I use? Thanks Dave, Denis and Noel for the interest

 

I am also fully sure the lads wouldn't do that Derek, a simple mistake could happen in a warehouse situation, it's a pity that you don't have any satisfaction with it, I'm baffled as to the reason.

[WRENNEIRE]

Running is essential for these locos, 20 mins in each direction dramatically alters the running noises

[Georgeconna]

1st batch were silent!

[WRENNEIRE]

4 hours ago, Georgeconna said:

1st batch were silent!

I think there is a new manufacturer for the motors, dont quote me

[Warbonnet]

12 hours ago, Gabhal Luimnigh said:

I am also fully sure the lads wouldn't do that Derek, a simple mistake could happen in a warehouse situation, it's a pity that you don't have any satisfaction with it, I'm baffled as to the reason.

Just for clarity here, any returned model goes to a different address than where the new models are dispatched from. If something is broken, we wouldn't just send it back out. We would replace with the borked model going straight back to Murphy Models who will either refund us or replace with a new model for our stocks.

[flange lubricator]

7 hours ago, WRENNEIRE said:

I think there is a new manufacturer for the motors, dont quote me

Massey Ferguson by the sounds of it .

[derek]

10 hours ago, Warbonnet said:

Just for clarity here, any returned model goes to a different address than where the new models are dispatched from. If something is broken, we wouldn't just send it back out. We would replace with the borked model going straight back to Murphy Models who will either refund us or replace with a new model for our stocks.

Well that is what I said Fran. There was never a question of me getting the same loco back as a replacement. It is just a pity that this one sounds just the same. Lovely model but it sounds like a piece of crap. The one I have from the original run sounds perfect. Dunno what the hell I am supposed to do now.

22 hours ago, WRENNEIRE said:

Running is essential for these locos, 20 mins in each direction dramatically alters the running noises

Dave, I ran it in for 60 mins in each direction and it still sounds rough (to say the least) 190sa I got from you a while back is perfect. Totally different animal. 

[Horsetan]

10 hours ago, flange lubricator said:

Massey Ferguson by the sounds of it .

Is Crossley back in business?

[commerlad]

29 minutes ago, Horsetan said:

Is Crossley back in business?

No. They were incorporated into AEC. (Although the factory was closed and the name was shelved)

Edited May 1 by commerlad

[irishthump]

A bit of a longshot, but one of my 141's had a wire that was hanging down and rubbing on the motor flywheels. Not saying it's the same thing but it made a similar noise, especially at higher speeds.

Might be worth taking the body off and having a look.

[Signal Post]

Hi @derek, that noise does not sound normal to me.

For comparison purposes I have uploaded a few clips of my new MM181 class (by co-incidence the same number) and I think you'll agree that they sound very different. I too have run mine in for 30 minutes in each direction but there was no appreciable difference in sound before and after. It sounds to me like your replacement loco has the same fault as your original one. One or two folk on here have suggested various repairs that you might attempt yourself which is fine if you have purchased an oldish second hand loco and have really no other option to make it work, in this case you have purchased a full price new loco with a warranty from a reputable dealer and manufacturer so if it were me I would definitely get back onto IRM for a further replacement or repair. In fairness I have found both IRM and Murphy Models (via Mark's Models shop) to be very good for warranty repair or replacement in the past

 

 

 

 

Hope these are of some help.

 

 

 

[derek]

22 hours ago, Signal Post said:

Hi @derek, that noise does not sound normal to me.

For comparison purposes I have uploaded a few clips of my new MM181 class (by co-incidence the same number) and I think you'll agree that they sound very different. I too have run mine in for 30 minutes in each direction but there was no appreciable difference in sound before and after. It sounds to me like your replacement loco has the same fault as your original one. One or two folk on here have suggested various repairs that you might attempt yourself which is fine if you have purchased an oldish second hand loco and have really no other option to make it work, in this case you have purchased a full price new loco with a warranty from a reputable dealer and manufacturer so if it were me I would definitely get back onto IRM for a further replacement or repair. In fairness I have found both IRM and Murphy Models (via Mark's Models shop) to be very good for warranty repair or replacement in the past

 

 

IMG_8620.MOV 36.82 MB · 3 downloads  

 

IMG_8621.MOV 23.23 MB · 1 download  

 

IMG_8622.MOV 44.82 MB · 0 downloads

 

Hope these are of some help.

 

 

 

Thanks @Signal Post. I can't view your videos on this laptop. ( have to update the app). I will check them on another device later on. It seems strange to me that I would get a replacement with the same fault, but who knows. I agree that I have paid enough for a new locomotive without taking the thing apart myself and compromising the warranty possibly. Won't be going there.  And yes, the lads at IRM are a pleasure to deal with. Looks like it's another email to Patrick then........ Sigh.... Your reply has confirmed what I was already thinking, thanks for that and for taking the time to post back.  Derek

[derek]

Just had a look at your videos, and to my ears your loco sounds quite like mine ( noisy) . Especially the second video. Think I will take up stamp collecting ha ha. 

[Signal Post]

I see what you mean about the second video, in fairness I was really giving it welly in that one and the unsecured track on timber without any underlay is probably not helping. I ran one of the original batch (2013?) on the track just now and it sounds very similar to the new one and at very low speeds I would say that they are both comparable to the MM 121s. I also have the iPhone quite close to the loco, from a normal hearing distance (say 2ft) it doesn't sound that noisy.

But the stamp collecting might be cheaper!

Edited May 3 by Signal Post

[derek]

23 hours ago, Signal Post said:

I see what you mean about the second video, in fairness I was really giving it welly in that one and the unsecured track on timber without any underlay is probably not helping. I ran one of the original batch (2013?) on the track just now and it sounds very similar to the new one and at very low speeds I would say that they are both comparable to the MM 121s. I also have the iPhone quite close to the loco, from a normal hearing distance (say 2ft) it doesn't sound that noisy.

But the stamp collecting might be cheaper!

I emailed the lads at IRM to ask about a possible repair or at least a check on the original to see if anything was wrong with it, instead of a replacement again. At least if I knew that the noise was normal, I would live with it. I just don't want to run a loco that is somehow faulty and make the matter worse. Still waiting on a reply, although it is the long weekend and the lads are only human after all. Will report back when I do get a reply. 

[Signal Post]

"The Lads" are in Wexford this weekend at the Wexford Model Railway Club's show! I wish I was there too as they always put on a good show there, but alas work gets in the way this time. Enjoy the weekend.

[derek]

Ok, so there has finally been a happy end to this saga. Briefly to recap, I received the original loco on 11th of April and it was noisy as hell. Sent it back and got a replacement a couple weeks later . It also sounded like a tractor, so after some arguing with myself, it also went back. Due to me getting stuck in hospital for a week, the courier finally picked up the loco on Monday 10th June and whisked it off to MM repairs. 3 weeks to the day later, it arrived back and it is running as sweet a a nut, so the perseverance was worth it in the end. Could have done without the grief but all's well that ends well. Have to say that Patrick Conboy was great throughout the whole thing. Loco arrived back without a word from Murphy's by email to say it was coming. There was no note to say what work had been carried out, so I am none the wiser. Communication is not a strong point with this outfit