Freight Containers (Irish) OO Gauge- 40ft or 20 ft

[flange lubricator]

49 minutes ago, popeye said:

Nice picture. That's an interesting end on the brown van.

Where was this location?

It's  Cork the Brown van with the pressed steel end is of GNR(I) origin the other is a standard CIE H van .

[leslie10646]

Dare I say it but Provincial Wagons have done both vans.

The GNR one is one of the 130-odd 16 ton bagged cement vans built in 1954 for the Drogheda cement factory. It was my first wagon and I had to double the order (to 200) after the first night I put it on my website.

I bet Mr Bracken can help you with one, but not in bauxite - there are 350 of mine around in various grey liveries.

The H van is still available as a kit from me, so those of you who don't have an aversion to kits know where to come!

As it's Christmas, I'll let you have them at €28 (£24) until the stock runs out. Another Euro off for each additional kit bought.

Leslie

Edited December 28, 2019 by leslie10646

[DiveController]

14 hours ago, flange lubricator said:

Another one common in the 1970's 30' Irish Ferryways can be seen in the background here 

 

Thanks for that, @flange lubricator. I had seen these in Cork yard and wasn't quite sure of the company. Here in the company of a CIE 40' and 20' (or 2x10's on top) so the difference is noticeable. Were they transported on 42' flats?

The Tara Mines wagons normally took the zinc ore to Dublin port but for a short period of only 6 week in the 90s it was transported to Arklow before 'resumption' of traffic to Dublin. Not sure if this traffic was in addition to or in lieu of the usual working but the ore was transported in what I though were double height open wagons covered with blue tarps. This photo from Adrian Roche in Cork and @h gricer comments suggest they were open top containers

https://www.flickr.com/photos/86202570@N02/26710573651/in/photolist-GGjEXV-F7oitJ-24FUSwq-GQNs88-Goadkb-GDYRy7-2dSksi8-JNKwGx-FSLqRC-GoaEnG-FSUd58-GoaUXd-FSUNjR-GDZqCy-24iqcyL-FSVHMc-FSVN8g-GDZtEf-GL4WrS-GGjKwp-RhQTHW-GNfW1B-JbT9CK-FSTY1g-GobSWs-TKmkaN-S6JYkd-TKkRiA-24iqcwb-HSdywP-qHDoGJ-2ezbmkq-wPLHYk-Tpiukw-wXciEu-rjuHuH-23nqegE-EiToDA-UucJZx-Ts9qkM-DotVFu-UC6xgS-wFjQqW-kuukAn-EaLdCG-UFKFYr-TsayLH-TsaJsM-Tpg7nY-Uuejnn

19 hours ago, Mayner said:

The "Back to Back" Fertiliser flats/swap bodies introduced in the late 1960s were fitted with ISO twistlocks, body was wider/longer than the wagon chassis and the adjustable bulkhead could potentially pinch a shunter while uncoupling/coupling up. 

The Back to Backs were basically treated as fertiliser wagons running in fixed formation block trains sometimes with bogie wagons or individual wagon loads until replaced by the bogie wagons in the mid-1970s.

 

John, @Mayner I alway thought these were an interesting fertilizer wagon. Were these unloaded by lowered the CIE end-piece over the buffers or was this to prevent the load moving only? or they stanchions were removed for side loading/unloading?

Edited December 29, 2019 by DiveController

[Mayner]

21 hours ago, DiveController said:

 

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/86202570@N02/26710573651/in/photolist-GGjEXV-F7oitJ-24FUSwq-GQNs88-Goadkb-GDYRy7-2dSksi8-JNKwGx-FSLqRC-GoaEnG-FSUd58-GoaUXd-FSUNjR-GDZqCy-24iqcyL-FSVHMc-FSVN8g-GDZtEf-GL4WrS-GGjKwp-RhQTHW-GNfW1B-JbT9CK-FSTY1g-GobSWs-TKmkaN-S6JYkd-TKkRiA-24iqcwb-HSdywP-qHDoGJ-2ezbmkq-wPLHYk-Tpiukw-wXciEu-rjuHuH-23nqegE-EiToDA-UucJZx-Ts9qkM-DotVFu-UC6xgS-wFjQqW-kuukAn-EaLdCG-UFKFYr-TsayLH-TsaJsM-Tpg7nY-Uuejnn

John, @Mayner I alway thought these were an interesting fertilizer wagon. Were these unloaded by lowered the CIE end-piece over the buffers or was this to prevent the load moving only? or they stanchions were removed for side loading/unloading?

One of the end bulkheads on the Back-to-Back fertiliser swap bodies was adjustable for securing the load, the side panels were removable by forklift for loading-unloading. The bagged cement wagons had an adjustable internal bulkhead at one end to prevent load shift.

Longitudinal movement is a significant issue when transporting palletised freight by rail and can contribute to de railments http://kiwirailfreight.co.nz/media/2719/section_20_palletised_freight.pdf

CIE published operating instructions for the Pallet Cement including a nice isometric drawing of a wagon in the "Weekly Circular" when the wagons were introduced in the late 70s similar instructions were issued for handling containers with forklift pockets when the Sligo Line went over to Liner Train operation around the same time.

It may be worth while looking through the "Weekly Circulars" in the IRRS Library or Archive for operating instructions when new wagons were introduced that involved changes to the freight handling system, there may be instructions for the Back to Backs and different types of Keg pallet.

[flange lubricator]

Those swap bodies look great when they were new but the removable sides were lost damaged and were replaced by some very homemade looking ones.

 

 

Edited December 30, 2019 by flange lubricator

[Mayner]

On 12/30/2019 at 1:36 PM, flange lubricator said:

Those swap bodies look great when they were new but the removable sides were lost damaged and were replaced by some very homemade looking ones.

 

 

Rough or agricultural does not exactly describe the replacement sides 6:00-

 

[jhb171achill]

Any of those things that I ever saw seemed very shabby, as mentioned above almost home-made bits added, and grubby....

I don’t think they lasted that long.

Edited December 31, 2019 by jhb171achill

[Arran]

HI All

Some good verity in this pic.

Regards Arran

 

[Rob]

Great pic-  'Bell' everywhere & 'Freightliner' thrown in-       Is there an approx date on this?

[DJ Dangerous]

1 hour ago, Rob said:

Great pic-  'Bell' everywhere & 'Freightliner' thrown in-       Is there an approx date on this?

Looks like a CIE Supertrain A Class, so that would be mid seventies to mid eighties?

[Warbonnet]

Going by the trucks I would say mid 80s at least. 

[jhb171achill]

11 hours ago, DJ Dangerous said:

Looks like a CIE Supertrain A Class, so that would be mid seventies to mid eighties?

At least late 80s, I suspect. The red and yellow Freightliner livery on those containers way up the far end would suggest this.

An essential for the 1970s would be B & I Line containers......

[Noel]

15 hours ago, Arran said:

HI All

Some good verity in this pic.

Regards Arran

 

Super photo. Where is it?

[Broithe]

24 minutes ago, Noel said:

Super photo. Where is it?

Adelaide - 1992.

https://www.lococarriage.org.uk/ireland_1992.html

[Arran]

HI All

I can see Tiphook , Cast , CTI and TEX, On the Link Freightliners , P&O , OCL and  Seaco.

Regards Arran

 

 

[DiveController]

On 12/29/2019 at 6:36 PM, flange lubricator said:

Those swap bodies look great when they were new but the removable sides were lost damaged and were replaced by some very homemade looking ones.

 

 

God, you're not wrong although you could say that same for the cement bubbles with only 3-6 being definitely identifiable with the Irish cement logo visible (in part)

[Rob]

Wondering what is going on in when you see workers with a long iron hook walking slowly alongside the container flats at North Wall, poking at some of the couplings (but not all)?

They take out the security chain aswell presumably to enable the containers be unloaded but wondering about the hook?

[DiveController]

The instanter couplings (modified three link) keep the buffers under compression in transit and won't go round tight curves in sidings like at North Wall without creating slack by turning the vertical center link horizontally. This is normally performed by a shunter with the hook but should be done on all couplings to prevent them coming under excessive strain 

 

Edited January 19, 2020 by DiveController
Diagram attached

[DiveController]

A couple more oddities, 20ft Lyons tea

 

And some which are just crackers

Unfortunately no evidence that these were transported by rail, at least not the 1980s 40' containers

Edited January 18, 2020 by DiveController

[jhb171achill]

I took a pic of one of those navy blue Lyons ones in Limerick about 1976, but I'm 99.999% certain none of the Jacobs ones (other than the small boxes) ever went by rail. If someone might show otherwise I'd be interested to know.

Edited January 18, 2020 by jhb171achill

[DiveController]

Post that Lyons if to hand please, jhb

[Mayner]

In the pre-Liner Train era Lyons Tea was distributed by rail in containers similar to the British Railways B containers https://peco-uk.com/products/lyons-tea-container

On CIE usually transported this type of container in open wagons (both wooden & corrugated rather than flats, used to see these container in goods trains departing Heuston Goods or on the yard headshunt, from the top deck of the 23 bus in the late 60s  early 70s, usually a single wagon marshalled immediately behind the loco

Jacobs/Irish Biscuits used trucks with a swap body system for distribution following their move from Bishop Street to Tallagh and may have used ISO containers in a similar manner. The ISO container on the semitrailer is set up with reflective warning stripes for road use something you don't see on a shipping container.

Before road transport de-regulation in  the early 1990s many large Irish companies operated their own road transport fleet as it was the only viable alternative to using CIE due to its near monopoly position and also tended to be more efficient and cost effective. The majority of businesses outsourced their transport to hauliers and contractors following de-regulation.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Mayner

[WRENNEIRE]

B&I

 

[DiveController]

Great shot! Two separate 20" containers, 1977?

Edited January 19, 2020 by DiveController

[jhb171achill]

15 minutes ago, DiveController said:

Great shot! Two separate 20" containers, 1977?

With the loco in "Supertrain" livery, you're looking at 1972-87. I'd say mid-70s probably, as I think the B & I ones weren't in that livery by 1987, if they were even on the railways at all....

 

1 hour ago, DiveController said:

Post that Lyons if to hand please, jhb

I'll try to find it, though the one above is a much better shot than mine!

As far as I recall, the only other place I saw a Lyons container on a 4w flat was in Heuston goods yard, where the car park is now.

 

 

On ‎12‎/‎29‎/‎2019 at 1:58 AM, DiveController said:

 

 

On ‎12‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 6:40 AM, Mayner said:

 

Aha!  Look at the 4w flat it's sitting on - silver! Painted thus for Asahi containers.

[jhb171achill]

I knew I wasn't dreaming, when I wrote that not all Bells had white roofs - initially, none had white roofs, though it's clear from later photos that most DID.

The vans are interesting too.

Left - a standard CIE "H" van.

Right - what looks like a 1954-built GNR cement van. Loads of these were built for the Cement factory branch; steam-hauled initially, of course.

On ‎12‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 11:32 AM, flange lubricator said:

[Rob]

Any one got photos of Bell Containers in their 'fallen flag' era, after the company stopped trading but the containers were still in use with the logo and 'BELL' wording crudely blanked out?

Would have been towards end of 1990's / very early 2000's?

Cheers

 

[jhb171achill]

For container fans, I found this in a pic today. Date uncertain - 1980s, I think.

[DiveController]

Likely crossing the Rory O' More bridge near Guinness brewery in Dublin ("Robert Daglish Junr. St. Helens Foundry Lancashire")

 

Edited March 6, 2020 by DiveController

[flange lubricator]

Fabulous picture by Jonathan Allen from Flickr lots of CIE containers and B&I line containers love to see C Rail do a 20' B&I container like this .

Edited March 9, 2020 by flange lubricator

[DiveController]

4 hours ago, flange lubricator said:

... lots of CIE containers and B&I line containers love to see C Rail do a 20'bell container like this .

+1

[Noel]

10 hours ago, flange lubricator said:

Fabulous picture by Jonathan Allen from Flickr lots of CIE containers and B&I line containers love to see C Rail do a 20'bell container like this .

C-Rail already do, it must be one of their best sellers (ie the Bell 20ft). IRMs recent 42ft flat wagons come with 40ft Bell's produced by C-Rail. (unless I've misunderstood something).

Single 20ft Bell midships upon 42ft container flat (3D FUD)

A pair of weather Bell's  - ding dong!  

Edited March 9, 2020 by Noel

[Warbonnet]

Correct, our 40ft Bell and B&I  containers were produced by C Rail (and very nice they are too). The 20ft CIE is one we did ourselves and we do plan to make these available separately in the future. 

The 20ft B&I  above is an earlier pattern of ISO container. They do look attractive, but not aware of anyone who does them in OO.

Cheers!

Fran

[WRENNEIRE]

Maybe its the B&I container?

Would be a super model

[DiveController]

On 3/8/2020 at 5:23 PM, flange lubricator said:

Fabulous picture by Jonathan Allen from Flickr lots of CIE containers and B&I line containers love to see C Rail do a 20' B&I container like this .

There's also an older CIE container unless that is the side of a Scammell mechanical horse, which it might be (between the legs of the crane behind the B+I). and another B+I or Freightliner in the red livery on the top left (unfortunately partly obscured also)

Edited March 11, 2020 by DiveController
TYPO