Future of the hobby

[RedRich]

I think the best way to gauge this sort of thing is to ask the retailers how many kids and teenagers frequent their shops and purchase model railway equipment. Look around at an exhibition and gauge the same thing there, how old are the visitors what percentage are kids and adults. I think that this is one hobby that has stood the test of time and there have been turbulent times for a lot of us of a certain age in our lifetimes with recessions and high unemployment. Kids today are very resourceful and they will try and earn a few bob to pay for their models as the young lads have stated above.

 

Vincent even went without his sausages, and he will benefit from it by having a point and stopping his arteries clogging . Groups like this draw an awful lot of young blood into the hobby as they will get advice comradeship and a voice to air their opinions for free, there is no doubt that for the majority of the time the internet has started a revolution and I wonder as groups like this grow will it have an effect on the print media within the hobby, as I find myself buying the monthly Railway Modelling mags less often as I find all the entertainment and knowledge here that I need. For me they also bring an enthusism that takes me back to my youth.

 

Rich,

[201bhoy]

Yeah I haven't bought a magazine in ages myself! I love this site, it's great to talk with other Irish modellers And as Rich said, modelling adds years onto your life!

[gm171 kk]

Credit also has to given to Anthony and Wiggy and anyone else who has uploaded videos of their models on youtube.

[RedRich]

Credit also has to given to Anthony and Wiggy and anyone else who has uploaded videos of their models on youtube.

 

I couldn't agree more with that statement as it has surely made people aware of the growing repertoire of Irish prototype models available to people that wouldn't be aware of the phenomenal growth of the hobby here, let alone the standards of the work that the lads produce. That kind of work and access to what is available has surely inspired many a young kid to have a go and also find their way to this group as a consequence of watching these videos.

 

Rich,

[WRENNEIRE]

Points?

Sausages?

Sausages and Pints every time!

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

Pints every time!

 

 

 

Did you not have enough pints Friday night the state of you sitting in my kitchen on Saturday morning should have taught you a lesson

[WRENNEIRE]

Do you not think I got enough crap off Granny Bracken without having to listen to yours?

Your as bad as any ould wan!

[purple]

If I do move to Dublin again I'm probably going to rent a whole house out in the suburbs to the south or west. I might join a club too.

 

Is there a MR club in Galway?

 

There isn't even a model shop here anymore, was talking to some friends about starting a run one out of the 091labs maker/hacker space here. Also trying to convince them to help build a huge layout .

[heirflick]

first train i got was a hornby clockwork goods set...an ovel of track with 3 wagons. thought i went to heaven when i got my second loco, which was the same model except operated by a battery controller - bliss! my first decent loco was 'princess elizbeth' with exhaust sound fitted...it really did give off the chuff chuff sound! jesus, those were the days...when we expected nothing so we were never dissapointed! with the onset of puberty and the first sight of hairs growing where they hadnt been before, not to mention the first surge of strength in my loins (thought rigor mortice was setting in!) it was deemed to be not cool to play with trains. all was stored until the year i got married....when i had to get a hobby fast to get away from herself and this weird notion that she had that i loved going shopping with her....walking 2 stepd behind her like a baby duck after its mother:rolleyes: - still the things we do for love! then the dark days arrived when the dreaded mother-in-law arrived, which is when i really threw myself into the hobby. speaking of halloween, i have to go and hang the hag, i mean the m-i-l outside to scare the kids tonight....great to see shes good for something!

Edited October 31, 2012 by heirflick

[heirflick]

i stand corrected on the loco name, it was 'princess victoria'. total crap in comparison with the detail on todays models, but good for the time!

 

Edited November 5, 2012 by heirflick

[merlinxlili]

A very interesting thread guys. Here are a few opinions to entertain you.

My very small kids started off developing a taste for Thomas DVDs (very good modelling there – have a look some of you!), then progressed to a DVD of the History of British steam (to see real steamers) and now prefer one of my Markle DVDs on Irish diesels all in orange & black. All this in 6 months. So why should they be so interested? Their exposure to real, toy or model trains has as yet been very limited.

Someone mentioned that they are not interested in railcars. I have quite broad interests in railways but would admit to having a very limited interest in the most modern generation of railcars. However I find the early Irish railcars fascinating, even though I have only seen one or two examples. They were world leaders in their day and somehow the styling and character of them seemed much more attractive to me than the latest types, despite the obvious improvements in technology & comfort.

So I think that a great big part of railway modelling is the (subconscious?) wish to produce a reminder of how things were before. Just look at the present interest in modelling Irish rail freight, even though there is now very little running in real-life. Personally I would love to build a 1950s or -60s Irish railway with beautiful countryside, or the sort generated by Colm Flanagan and his gang.

Reproducing actual railway operation is another honeypot which can generate great interest. I suspect that very few attain that particular nirvana, since you really need a group of enthusiasts and a largish railway for it to work. My favorite model railway of this sort is the WLWR Moygraney line in 7mm which has been in-building for several decades. I guess a club is the only chance for that sort of thing.

This says nothing about why young folk should develop an interest in railway modelling, unless perhaps they move over from a general interest in railways or other types of modelling.

[WRENNEIRE]

Herflick

Just in case you might be interested I have tons of spare parts for the older Tri-Ang models

Bodies Chassis's wheels motors etc

[RedRich]

A very interesting thread guys. Here are a few opinions to entertain you.

My very small kids started off developing a taste for Thomas DVDs (very good modelling there – have a look some of you!), then progressed to a DVD of the History of British steam (to see real steamers) and now prefer one of my Markle DVDs on Irish diesels all in orange & black. All this in 6 months. So why should they be so interested? Their exposure to real, toy or model trains has as yet been very limited.

Someone mentioned that they are not interested in railcars. I have quite broad interests in railways but would admit to having a very limited interest in the most modern generation of railcars. However I find the early Irish railcars fascinating, even though I have only seen one or two examples. They were world leaders in their day and somehow the styling and character of them seemed much more attractive to me than the latest types, despite the obvious improvements in technology & comfort.

So I think that a great big part of railway modelling is the (subconscious?) wish to produce a reminder of how things were before. Just look at the present interest in modelling Irish rail freight, even though there is now very little running in real-life. Personally I would love to build a 1950s or -60s Irish railway with beautiful countryside, or the sort generated by Colm Flanagan and his gang.

Reproducing actual railway operation is another honeypot which can generate great interest. I suspect that very few attain that particular nirvana, since you really need a group of enthusiasts and a largish railway for it to work. My favorite model railway of this sort is the WLWR Moygraney line in 7mm which has been in-building for several decades. I guess a club is the only chance for that sort of thing.

This says nothing about why young folk should develop an interest in railway modelling, unless perhaps they move over from a general interest in railways or other types of modelling.

 

I honestly think it is something you are born with. A club is definitely a great environment to be involved in as there are so many aspects of the hobby you can gain experience from should you ever decide on a build of your own layout. The Markle dvd's are great for hearing those sounds that are now a part of history.

 

Rich,

[Horsetan]

Modelling the Irish scene has historically presented a challenge, particularly if you're doing it in Ireland. It is only in the last 15-20 years that things have become easier in terms of stock, kits and all the rest. For that we have the Internet to thank - it's that much easier to order what you're after, and information about what's available is more accessible.

 

I remember first coming to Dublin back in 1988, during an unemployment peak, and only ever seeing one model shop (Murphy's) in the whole place. It sold British-outline stock; I don't remember seeing anything in CIE/IE/IR livery there at the time. My parents took me around much of Ireland that year, and I never saw another model shop. The economic situation back then focussed people's minds on emigration, not modelling.

 

I think TMD kits (now SSM) existed back then, but actually getting hold of any was a challenge. They were not very well publicised in Britain, if at all.

 

Today, things are that much better materially, thanks to the Celtic Tiger, even if it did have a propensity to prowl around on quicksand. The very fact that this Forum exists to showcase what's being done demonstrates how much Irish modelling has developed out of almost nothing.

 

You lot are still only youngsters wait till you hit your 40's:(((

 

I'm just after turning 41. I've been in model railways in one form or another since the age of 5; dead-scale Scalefour since 1990, but modelling 5'3" (21mm gauge) only started this year. Just after realising that if/when I finish this "S" class, I'll have no 21mm gauge track to run it on

 

Since I no longer have youthful good looks, I resorted to radical plastic surgery and now look like this:

 

Edited November 4, 2012 by Horsetan

[Broithe]

56...

 

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

 

 

I'm just after turning 41. I've been in model railways in one form or another since the age of 5; dead-scale Scalefour since 1990, but modelling 5'3" (21mm gauge) only started this year. Just after realising that if/when I finish this "S" class, I'll have no 21mm gauge track to run it on

 

 

 

The same here I'm 42 and been at it from around the same age as regards the 21mm track I've never bothered with it due to it not been readily available and from what I've seen very few people ever seem to get a proper sized layout up and running. That's why I would rather just use Peco track so I can run trains:trains:

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

If only they did this with 21mm track

 

 

[video=youtube;0p02-uEUHiI]

[Mayner]

I am not sure if it was Scaletric or other hobbies and pastimes but model railways seem to have almost disappeared off the radar in Dublin in the early 70s.

 

Apart from Monck Place and Southern Model Railways most Department Stores many bicycle/TV and electrical shops had a Traing agency and stocked Triang-Hornby train sets and sometimes track and accessories.

 

I used to look at the sets in the window of Lamberts TV shop in Crumlin village on the way to and from school, especially the break down train with its Jinty, crane and interesting looking bottles of oil.

 

A few years later it was only Terry's Toy shop in Henry Street and the two specialist model railway shops. My first set was the oddly named "South African Goods" the recently released M7 and four wagons. Unlike Seamus Princess the M7 did not last very long was traded in for a diesel shunter and I started my long tradition of cutting, carving and bashing.

 

The attitude to model railways was different then and it wasnt a done thing for a teenager let alone a grown man to be seen playing with trains.

 

These days our 3 year old daughter has her own set and has mastered the remote controi, and I might actually have space for a permanent layout.

[Weshty]

There's been a big change in what qualifies as "approved" manly hobbies over the last decade or so. Another aspect is that grown men are now free to wear the sort of t-shirts we would have given our left arms to wear back in 3rd and 4th class. The popularity of Gaming is another manifestation of the same thing.

 

I agree that it changed in the 70's alright. I remember that Eason's in Patrick St. in Cork used to have a MASSIVE Hornby layout every Christmas. Then by the early 80's it all just went, along with the shops (Trains, Boats and Planes etc.). Great to see it all back again, and d'internet has played no small part.

[heirflick]

Herflick

Just in case you might be interested I have tons of spare parts for the older Tri-Ang models

Bodies Chassis's wheels motors etc

 

thanks dave, nice to know should i need them!

[Portoman]

Unlike most of you guys I am part of the silver haired brigade -the bit I have. I've always had an interest in model railways but only ever had a cheap Lima one back in the 70's. Now I'm getting back into it and am building one in the attic. The fact the the hobby is still going after almost 70 yrs is testement to the enjoyment one can get. It'll always be small over here but will continue. The only thing is prices of Locos and stock can inhibit younger people joining. I dread telling the missus I'm spending €180 on engines. When your older bruises take longer to disapear !!! But she loves me !!

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

Unlike most of you guys I am part of the silver haired brigade -the bit I have. I've always had an interest in model railways but only ever had a cheap Lima one back in the 70's. Now I'm getting back into it and am building one in the attic. The fact the the hobby is still going after almost 70 yrs is testement to the enjoyment one can get. It'll always be small over here but will continue. The only thing is prices of Locos and stock can inhibit younger people joining. I dread telling the missus I'm spending €180 on engines. When your older bruises take longer to disapear !!! But she loves me !!

 

 

Welcome to the site Portoman and I'm looking forward to seeing photos etc of your progress of your layout and collection

[Noel]

Was chatting with a few friends last week and we had been musing the important role train sets once had. It was said in times past nearly every boy in the population got at least one train set for a birthday or Christmas present before the age of 16.

These had many varied developmental and social benefits, not to mention the first wrung of the ladder in the hobby. Track work construction now often forgotten was a huge part of it as youngsters experienced geometry, tactile playability and feel, construction and design skills, resource management, logical stock movements, basic electrics, train operations and let imaginations run loose as they built, disassembled and reassembled imaginary worlds in many variations. There was the additional dimension of set track packs and extending train set layouts over the years, interacting with fathers and friends, swapping and exchanging items of stock and track, learning to fix things, remove carpet from gear trains, lub frozen locos, connect wires, later build and paint layout scenery items, and above all else "play".

Youngsters subliminally learned so many varied engineering and electrical skills in addition to the social interaction. In the current era of virtual play in front of dancing LCD screens one wonders where the hobby might be in 20 years time demographically?

[David Holman]

I think we already know, Noel. While there are still train sets available at reasonable prices & in a variety of themes, railway modelling is mostly the preserve of the older generation. Add in the fact that a 4mm scale locomotive can cost well over £150 and one can see why a disposable income certainly helps too. 

 The rise of electronic games, computers etc means that a model railway has not been top of the list to Santa for quite a few years. Another issue is the 'throw away/ephemeral nature of many toys and games. For example, one of these days, I am going to weaken and buy a small radio controlled helicopter for 20 quid or so, but I also know that after a couple of hours I will be bored with it - assuming it doesn't break beforehand.

 In my primary headteacher days [late 90s -early 00s] I used to like asking the kids what they had got for Christmas. One assembly, I had to actually ask if any of them had got any toys, because all the answers involved computers, Xboxes, clothes & music players. Paints, crayons & cuddly toys were in similar short supply. Like the rest of my teaching career, the school was in a tough area and though rarely short of material goods, the kids did not all get the adult attention they needed at home. The ones that did, really stood out, because they were SO much easier to work with.

 However, the benefits of model railways don't stop in childhood. There is a growing amount of anecdotal evidence that railway modeller are significantly less likely to develop dementia, because the hobby keeps the brain active. High blood pressure, resorting to drink, excessive bad language etc another matter of course!

[Warbonnet]

I think there is a lack of imagination in the marketing and product development too. The trusty British trainset from the established names lack any additional play value and attention grabbing features compared to say, the Triang days. Marklin are doing it properly with their "My World" series, offering durable models of glamourous prototypes like the ICE and TGV, fun freight trains with tipping logs, working cranes etc, and then the wireless remote. It's one of the most popular toys in Germany and with good reason. 

[Weshty]

Some of the big retailers this Christmas didn't even appear to have a single OO train set available in their 200 page catalogue.

[jhb171achill]

With space and budget undoubtable considerations for either young people, or the increasing number of single parents, I suspect that layout may become "online" more. This, while regrettable to the likes of us, may be the way it'll go. "Virtual" locos could be bought / downloaded, with "virtual" layouts on computer screens, like the popular game of "Sims" of such complexity that the same thing in real life would cover a few acres.

[Garfield]

From meeting many of our customers over the past 18 months or so, I've been pleasantly surprised at the age range. Many are in the 30-50 bracket, which is at odds with the perception that the hobby is mainly the preserve of the older generation. 

As Fran said, Marklin's kids' sets are among the most popular toys in Germany. They're also compatible with the regular Marklin sets, which helps promotes quality parent/child time, too, as well as nurturing interest in the hobby. There's a distinct lack of an equivalent product in the OO market...

On a related note, there's very little promotion of the hobby towards people who don't already have an interest in railways, certainly here and in the UK...

[Broithe]

Due to almost annual house moves, often to different countries, I never had a train set at all. I did come across them in the houses of the "settled populations" and it was always 'on the list', but circumstances made it a little awkward to have anything with any permanence. I did, though, get as far as one of the Lone Star die-cast ones that was around N Gauge in size.

Edited January 5, 2018 by Broithe

[roxyguy]

Glad to see Marklin My World mentioned here, it's a fantastic range. I think a big problem is price. The perception of the hobby is one of cost.

If hornby could gather up all there old tooling (lima included) and launch a proper budget line aimed at young punters it might help the situation.

The railroad range is a bit of a joke. £100 for a Lima deltic, seriously???

[BosKonay]

Couldn’t agree more. Most of that range is total price gouging. 

[roxyguy]

A young fella (11 years old) came to the house to see my layout, he's into model trains and has a few hornby starter sets. Starter sets range between €80-150, which means he has to wait for birthdays/christmas before he can add to his own layout. I could tell he was frustrated, he can't fish for bargains on ebay the way we can. If basic wagons in blister packs were widely and cheaply available (€5-10), basic 0-4-0's €20, A bo-bo €30 - they could be bought with pocket money by young fellas on a weekly/monthly basis - which keeps the interest in the hobby going.

Hornby recently sold a continental lima shunter for £25 and a bo-bo for £30 and they sold out, which means there is a demand for cheap entry level products. The high fidelity stuff is amazing but without entry level stuff there will be no hobby in the future.

[jhb171achill]

11 minutes ago, roxyguy said:

A young fella (11 years old) came to the house to see my layout, he's into model trains and has a few hornby starter sets. Starter sets range between €80-150, which means he has to wait for birthdays/christmas before he can add to his own layout. I could tell he was frustrated, he can't fish for bargains on ebay the way we can. If basic wagons in blister packs were widely and cheaply available (€5-10), basic 0-4-0's €20, A bo-bo €30 - they could be bought with pocket money by young fellas on a weekly/monthly basis - which keeps the interest in the hobby going.

Hornby recently sold a continental lima shunter for £25 and a bo-bo for £30 and they sold out, which means there is a demand for cheap entry level products. The high fidelity stuff is amazing but without entry level stuff there will be no hobby in the future.

This is ABSOLUTELY true. Very well said indeed.

When I started out, Hornby did a cheap little 0.4.0T, which depending on whether you wanted a red, green or blue one was called "Polly", "Nellie" or "Connie".

It was actually a very nice little thing, very comparable with the better standards of the day and not as toy-like as some of its imitators ten and twenty years later.

In my late teens, Irish-themed layouts were impossible without scratch building every single solitary thing, so mine was BR. I decided to add a few details to it and paint in In lined BR black as a shunter. It looked very well indeed in that guise - so entry level doesn't even need to mean "toy".

Things like that are badly needed. Cheap to buy, but reasonable looking. And - sufficiently reasonable looking that if the child becomes a serious modelller they can still make something out of it later on if they want.

[Dave]

I don't think that it's just the older generation that will be left in the hobby. Yes there has been a decline but I see quite a lot of newcomers coming into the hobby. About 60% of my customers are new to the hobby and a large portion are recently retired that have always wanted to get into the hobby. I also see quite a lot of young people, I sell a lot of 6 x 4 baseboards particularly coming up to Christmas. Ten 6 x 4 baseboards went out this Christmas.

The hobby has changed direction on the way people shop and communicate. Facebook has changed this and I get a lot of my business through Facebook. Facebook groups are getting very popular too.

Pat made a very good point about promoting the hobby, the club's in Ireland don't do enough to promote the hobby to the younger generation. North Down club are very proactive in promoting their show in Bangor in April, they use a Facebook promotional campaign and invite all the local schools to take part in a colouring competition. Prizes are donated by Bachmann and BT. 

They also bring a layout to a shopping centre on the weeks leading up to a show and collect money for charity while promoting the hobby.

[Broithe]

It's not just a "young v old" thing - there is also a "male v female" aspect.

I've always felt that promotion of layouts as "smaller dolls' houses in a landscape setting" may have some mileage..