2021 New Releases for the Irish Market?

[jhb171achill]

I suppose I've mentioned it before, but I tend to prefer the practical, in the sense of what is currently missing in RTR and kit form, and would be absolutely essential for authenticity in a given period. With growing interest in the "grey'n'green" era, me being one of 'em, practicality absolutely dictates a RTR CIE 20T or 30T guard's van, several types of laminates, Park Royals and above all - tin vans in all three liveries, and of all types.

With a tiny few exceptions (e.g. the Loughrea coach), quite simply ALL passenger trains in the sixties and seventies had a generator van. Four and six wheeled ones up to 1969, exclusively, with the Dutch added in 1969 and BR in '72, and of course after that the Mk 2 and eventually Mk 3 ones. But we're talking here aboyt the sixties, so the 4 and 6 wheeld ones are an absolute necessity.

The OTHER absolute necessity for main line passenger in the 1950-65 period is the AEC railcars, as ubiquitous and commonplace then as ICRs are now on main lines.

These things are a must. There was scarcely a line which didn't have them, in many cases as much a "staple diet" as ICRs on the Midland today.

Edited January 19, 2021 by jhb171achill

[leslie10646]

JHB, Impossible to disagree re the RTR CIE brake van - very badly needed, as are those tin vans.

If you saw my IRRS talk in December, I showed a photo of a Cross-border train behind a Tank with no less than three on the back! They were EVERYWHERE. The word ubiquitous was invented for them!

 

 

[jhb171achill]

23 minutes ago, leslie10646 said:

JHB, Impossible to disagree re the RTR CIE brake van - very badly needed, as are those tin vans.

If you saw my IRRS talk in December, I showed a photo of a Cross-border train behind a Tank with no less than three on the back! They were EVERYWHERE. The word ubiquitous was invented for them!

 

 

Indeed - you and I will recall them well. You could have more than three on a mail train especially, often a few at the front and a few at the back.

One of Barry Carse's pics shows the daily Limerick train about to leave Ballina. The consist, as far as I remember, is two different laminates, a tin van in the middle of the train, a bogie brake standard (converted laminate) and another tin van. You'd get them in the middle too, once in blue moon, especially if an extra coach was added on at the last minute.

In the grey-121-era, standard practice was usually a four wheeled heating van ("hot water bottle") at one end of the train, and a "LV" (luggage van) type at the other. In reality, for us modellers, the thing is that some sort of "tin vans" are needed on every train, otherwise it has no heat or light!

AEC cars had their own heating boilers in the power car - one at least on each set - but even STILL often trailed a tin van to carry parcels. In this guise, "tin vans" covered the whole West Cork system, and invaded the UTA where they were commonplace the whole way to Belfast, and were also to be seen on the Derry Road; photos show them in Foyle Road, Strabane and Omagh. I woild imagine they may have reached Warrenpoint. Needless to say, long gone lines within the CIE network saw them EVERYWHERE: Tralee - Valencia Harbour and Kenmare, Tralee - Limerick - Sligo, Mallow - Waterford, the North Kerry line, Kilkenny - Port Laoise and so on.

I've never seen a picture of one on the Cavan branch, and if they did get to there it would have been only just after the very first ones were built, and on a goods train. There is even an OUTSIDE possibility (David Holman & Galteemore Alert!) that an early one MIGHT have got to Enniskillen over the SLNCR, as the very earliest ones were setting out and about then - though to be fair its unlikely, and could only have been within a goods train. CIE goods stock was often to be seen, for obvious reasons, along the SLNCR, and many pics show newish "H" vans as quite a contrast to the SLNCR's run-down, runcible and crumpled antiques still carrying goods!

Tin vans in GOODS trains? Not really - but there's an exception to every rule, isn't there? I saw one in a goods train between Dundalk and Belfast one time about 1970. I've no idea why - it may have been carrying parcels, or it may just have been worked back to Dundalk, maybe having been a "cripple" off the "Enterprise".

On NIR, they were regularly to be seen on early morning Portadown - Belfast railcars, their smart black'n'tan quite a contrast with by-now-tired NIR maroon and grey AEC railcars.

I would be interested to know if a CIE "tin van" ever got near the Larne or Derry lines. I very much doubt it, and have never heard of it, but the Larne line in the 1960s had very considerable mail and parcels traffic, and you could get the UTA equivalent, the NCC brown vans - up to maybe SIX of them, tagged onto the back of Belfast - Larne railcars. Very much CDRJC operations- stick a few wagons at the back of a railcar set!

Edited January 20, 2021 by jhb171achill

[Westcorkrailway]

24 minutes ago, jhb171achill said:

With a tiny few exceptions (e.g. the Loughrea coach), quite simply ALL passenger trains in the sixties and seventies had a generator van. Four and six wheeled ones up to 1969, exclusively, with the Dutch added in 1969 and BR in '72, and of course after that the Mk 2 and eventually Mk 3 ones. But we're talking here aboyt the sixties, so the 4 and 6 wheeld ones are an absolute necessity.

 

15 minutes ago, leslie10646 said:

JHB, Impossible to disagree re the RTR CIE brake van - very badly needed, as are those tin vans.

If you saw my IRRS talk in December, I showed a photo of a Cross-border train behind a Tank with no less than three on the back! They were EVERYWHERE. The word ubiquitous was invented for them!

 

 

They were quite numerous werent they, you would see the dirty silver ones. I think silver fox make some version but a fully detailed propperly tooled one would be a must for the era

 

 

Seeing that hattons have released a 2nd wave of their genisis coaches, I would hope on a 3rd wave or 4th in 2021 or early 2022 may yield an irish livery...well maybe..

[jhb171achill]

3 minutes ago, Westcorkrailway said:

Seeing that hattons have released a 2nd wave of their genisis coaches, I would hope on a 3rd wave or 4th in 2021 or early 2022 may yield an irish livery...well maybe..

I am sure a Hattons Irish six-wheeler would indeed be a winner. That design is similar to several GSWR types, so would be appropriate for almost all the CIE system (a few Midland branches less likely but possible). They aren't like GNR, DNGR, NCC or BCDR types, though. Certainly, I'd buy a few!

And yes, the "tin vans" WERE not just numerous, but absolutely essential. Silverfox have offered several types of these, including the 1965-built six-wheeled ones. The four wheeled ones are offered in green or black'n'tan, but as far as I am aware they haven't offered them in silver.

You mention the liveries.

4-wheeled ones and 4-wheeled TPOS: 

First, all-silver (roofs, ends, chassis, buffers, couplings, EVERYTHING unpainted, thus "silver").

From roughly 1958 they started painting them the post-1955 green (none ever had "snails") with black roofs and ends, and any newly built ones had this livery from new.

From 1963, they started painting them black'n'tan.

However, these vans were last in the queue for TLC or repainting. Thus, some of the earlier ones retained their "silver" livery, in reality what they'd be like after a week submerged in a tin of weathering powders - the actual "livery" quite simply non-existent, like the corrugated wagons - just a nondescript dirt colour - through the green period and on into black'n'tan times. Equally, many green ones remained green, and increasingly shabby looking, into the black'n'tan era.

So when we have our shiny grey 121s, or silver, plain black or green "A"s, the appropriate mix (this is 1961-5) will be roughly equal numbers of truly filthy "silver", green and black'n'tan vans. By 1967, almost all BnT.

Needless to say, the six-wheeled heating vans were only ever black'n'tan - they never carried any other livery.

 

[Patrick Davey]

4 hours ago, Westcorkrailway said:

.....the only off the shelf irish steam locos have been the mogul and the flying snail pocket rocket. And even those were re-skins....

....and the NCC Jinty...... but don't forget the OO Works locos......... 

[Mayner]

57 minutes ago, leslie10646 said:

JHB, Impossible to disagree re the RTR CIE brake van - very badly needed, as are those tin vans.

If you saw my IRRS talk in December, I showed a photo of a Cross-border train behind a Tank with no less than three on the back! They were EVERYWHERE. The word ubiquitous was invented for them!

 

 

Just to confirm that the  JM Design CIE 20T goods brake will be produced as a rtr model starting with the 1950s-early 60s flying snail version our printer has successfully re-located his business to a new premises.

 

There are a number of traditional loose coupled wagons in the pipeline based on the Standard IRCH 9'6" steel underframe which will be announced once we have completed the CAD work or a pre-production sample.

 

[Robert Shrives]

Leslie,

Indeed and the hobby would be poorer without your kits.  "Spoils of war" are great wagons  and the double beets were great to produce. With a bit of cross fertilisation  of SSM, MIR  and IRM bits and your 20 foot flat or skeletal does give lots of choice.  The coal container could be a quick win with 3D printing - unless you are the designer and printer of course !  The Bitumen wagon that got mentioned needs four suppliers and your skeletal.  This is indeed the fun of modelling - get bits together and assembling. But not for everybody so rtr has its place.  But the hobby is a place for everybody.

Robert      

[Westcorkrailway]

13 hours ago, Mayner said:

Just to confirm that the  JM Design CIE 20T goods brake will be produced as a rtr model starting with the 1950s-early 60s flying snail version our printer has successfully re-located his business to a new premises.

 

 

 

Looks great, grey 121 owners will be pleased with Any RTR "flying snail" stock

[K801]

I don't think there would be much of a market for thousands of new Mk3s, especially as Silverfox still sells them and they come up on fleabay every month

realistically I think modern rolling stock would make a lot more financial sense and as said before, introduce a whole new breed of modern modeler into the lobby

love them or hate them; Mk4s, IRCs, DARTs etc. is the way to go. We need something operating in 2021 that will still be in IE operation for the next 20 years

what would a 20 something year old pick up in Marks Models getting into the hobby, a model of a 70 year old Park Royal or a current Mk4 that he just traveled in on from Carlow

and been an armchair modeler, that's my two cents lol

[Westcorkrailway]

48 minutes ago, K801 said:

I don't think there would be much of a market for thousands of new Mk3s, especially as Silverfox still sells them and they come up on fleabay every month

realistically I think modern rolling stock would make a lot more financial sense and as said before, introduce a whole new breed of modern modeler into the lobby

love them or hate them; Mk4s, IRCs, DARTs etc. is the way to go. We need something operating in 2021 that will still be in IE operation for the next 20 years

what would a 20 something year old pick up in Marks Models getting into the hobby, a model of a 70 year old Park Royal or a current Mk4 that he just traveled in on from Carlow

and been an armchair modeler, that's my two cents lol

I'm 17 and I'd gladly buy 70 year old park royals, us youngsters love new stuff but we like the old stuff too! Although to be fair i see the point...201 in IE livery could have done with mark 4s and the proper DVT. I think the ICR amd DMUs can be purchased off chris dier so at least that is an option. But you can't just walk into marks models to get one

Edited January 20, 2021 by Westcorkrailway

[Georgeconna]

MK.3 rakes are mostly too long for the average layout too, I have a rake done on my 12ft long one and it takes up the whole scenic Area.

The old Park Royals and Cravens make nice smaller length trains.

[Broithe]

Obviously, the live-steam turf-burner will have been bumped up the list by the news that Bord na Mona are not going to be holding stocks of the necessary material for the required microsods for much longer.

[Westcorkrailway]

8 minutes ago, Georgeconna said:

MK.3 rakes are mostly too long for the average layout too, I have a rake done on my 12ft long one and it takes up the whole scenic Area.

The old Park Royals and Cravens make nice smaller length trains.

Or the hattons 3 wheeler if that feeling in my gut comes true!

[murphaph]

A MK3 suburban set would make a lovely short train for many smaller layouts. Plenty of 121s out there waiting for such a set now.

 

[leslie10646]

39 minutes ago, Georgeconna said:

MK.3 rakes are mostly too long for the average layout too, I have a rake done on my 12ft long one and it takes up the whole scenic Area.

The old Park Royals and Cravens make nice smaller length trains.

A lot of sensible comment in the last few posts. Good to see our young man from CBSCR territory saying he'd not mind the older stock, but George's comment is the one to home in on -

it's we old men, with big houses/lofts (or garden sheds?) who have the space for a longer train - and believe me, I can run a GNR 4-4-0 round with eleven bogies on - but we're a minority (?). The great thing about the late 1950s/1960s was that on secondary lines (not many of us have room for a main line run) the trains were 2/3 coaches, often a mix of Ancient and Modern with a tin van and hauled by a J15, or a "new" diesel - like Paddy's single-ended B Class, or the Lads' A Class. So a tin van and either Laminate or Park Royal would be nice for you guys modelling such things.

Back to K801's comment - he's dead right - a lot of the younger generation (or generations yet unborn) will be looking for what they remember seeing, or still see - hence (I can't believe I'm saying this) the modern coaches for your 201 Class and a ICR set (with an oval of track) are what they'll be looking for.

With that, back to the 1950s, blue locos and mahogany coaches........  I can just about make it up the stairs into the loft to run them.

[Westcorkrailway]

8 minutes ago, leslie10646 said:

A lot of sensible comment in the last few posts. Good to see our young man from CBSCR territory saying he'd not mind the older stock, but George's comment is the one to home in on 

Back to K801's comment - he's dead right - a lot of the younger generation (or generations yet unborn) will be looking for what they remember seeing, or still see - hence (I can't believe I'm saying this) the modern coaches for your 201 Class and a ICR set (with an oval of track) are what they'll be looking for.

With that, back to the 1950s, blue locos and mahogany coaches........  I can just about make it up the stairs into the loft to run them.

The Bachmann DMU set set from a few years ago would have been a good example of that, but im unsure if we will very see an irish train set for a long while. Its very hard to get into the hobby with the prices and a train set...well it would have to be 150-180 euro to get people my age into it. 

 

Even so i don't see too many 20 year old getting into modeling, 40 seems to be when people start when theh get nastalgic about the trains they used to take. Our generation can barely remember when the odd train was orange! Granted while i love my old stuff, 201 with maybe 2 mark fours and a mark four dvt at the end in an oval layout would be irresistible as that is the train of our time I suppose. At the same time the reason i like the old CBSC stuff goes to show that people who live near closed lines and want a model of what ran on them....thats another side 

 

 

[Georgeconna]

1 hour ago, murphaph said:

A MK3 suburban set would make a lovely short train for many smaller layouts. Plenty of 121s out there waiting for such a set now.

 

Quite! Ala the Limerick Junction Shuffle

 

[DJ Dangerous]

5 hours ago, murphaph said:

A MK3 suburban set would make a lovely short train for many smaller layouts. Plenty of 121s out there waiting for such a set now.

 

Much as I'd kill for a few Mk3 push-pull sets, I suspect that Mk4's might be a better bet, as they've been on the go a while, and probably have a good few years left in them.

23 hours ago, gm171 kk said:

Right with you there. 

I'm a bit freight heavy so I'll say an Arrow, Mk3 and Mk3 Push Pull also. 

Same here, a bit freight-heavy, and hungry for IR / IE passenger stock.

6 hours ago, K801 said:

realistically I think modern rolling stock would make a lot more financial sense and as said before, introduce a whole new breed of modern modeler into the lobby

love them or hate them; Mk4s, IRCs, DARTs etc. is the way to go. We need something operating in 2021 that will still be in IE operation for the next 20 years

what would a 20 something year old pick up in Marks Models getting into the hobby, a model of a 70 year old Park Royal or a current Mk4 that he just traveled in on from Carlow

and been an armchair modeler, that's my two cents lol

Yeah, and in ten or twenty years time, what is currently on the rails may actually be legacy stock, the grey 071's being the stuff of legend that people can barely remember.

5 hours ago, Georgeconna said:

MK.3 rakes are mostly too long for the average layout too, I have a rake done on my 12ft long one and it takes up the whole scenic Area.

The old Park Royals and Cravens make nice smaller length trains.

I guess if you were to run a shorter train, not prototypical length, that would solve that problem! Because of the length of the coaches, less units are needed to build up a nice long train to fit within ones desired space.

[jhb171achill]

7 hours ago, Westcorkrailway said:

The Bachmann DMU set set from a few years ago would have been a good example of that, but im unsure if we will very see an irish train set for a long while. Its very hard to get into the hobby with the prices and a train set...well it would have to be 150-180 euro to get people my age into it. 

Even so I don't see too many 20 year old getting into modelling, 40 seems to be when people start when theh get nastalgic about the trains they used to take. Our generation can barely remember when the odd train was orange! Granted while i love my old stuff, 201 with maybe 2 mark fours and a mark four dvt at the end in an oval layout would be irresistible as that is the train of our time I suppose. At the same time the reason i like the old CBSC stuff goes to show that people who live near closed lines and want a model of what ran on them....that's another side 

Westcorkrailway, it is indeed greatly inspiring to see folks your age getting involved.

You are absolutely right in all the points you make. When I was your age, dangerously close to fifty years ago, steam was only just gone (in the north, anyway; a little longer on CIE), but I was personally interested in stuff that would have been operating in the period just before I was born, and when I was too young to remember. I retain that interest today. My father, born in 1918, was fascinated with the railways of the 1900-25 period, and recalled the first time he saw carriages painted in the "new" GSR maroon, instead of a somewhat duller, older shade used by the DSER on the Harcourt St. line in Dublin, in which he travelled to school for a time.

Your interest, being in the West Cork system, is commendable. Even I don't remember that, as it was closed before I started school, and there was the small issue of me never being in that neck'o'the woods anyway. However, there are some short cuts for you.

Your long-term goal may be a couple of the brass kits of "Bandon Tanks" from Studio Scale Models (practice soldering etc., on something small and cheap first!), but there are several things you could look at to start with.

LOCOMOTIVES

Roderick Bruce of "00 Works" is about to do a Cork, Bandon & South Coast 0.6.0 saddle tank loco - now, there were only a few, and the last one expired about 1943 - but "poetic licence" will allow you to pretend that one lasted later. This will be a ready-to-run model and may well be available right now - I haven't checked for a while. It's pricey - but a word with Santa Claus might prove fruitful - that's what I ended up appealing to when I was 17!

Silverfox Models (google him) will do a kit of a "C" class - the only type of diesel that ran all over the West Cork system, and monopolised most services - goods and passenger - by the time the line closed, bar the Bantry passenger train which was a railcar. A filthy silver one and a green one will do the job.

Silverfox also do a railcar set. Who knows, maybe a ready-to-run AEC set will appear in the future, but this one might start you off. get a two-car one.

Once you master brass building, or if you know anyone who can help, Studio Scale Models and Worsley Works also do several bogie coaches of the period - Laminates, Bredins and Park Royals. One or other of these is a good thing as a centre car for the railcar set; if there was a GAA special or something, the AEC railcar set could be 4 carriages.

Older wooden coaches for Baltimore or Clonakilty tended to be GSWR types, with some old GSWR and MGWR six-wheelers used on excursions. Hattons will be bringing out six-wheelers - a repaint of one into CIE green might do? (I've no idea what livery they are). Studio Scale and Worsley also do KITS of GSWR six-wheelers. Then there were the Bachmann "CIE" green coaches out of train sets with "Woolwich" locos - while the loco is inappropriate for West Cork, the coach would do you for a Clonakilty branch train.

All trains hauled by "C" class diesels will need a luggage / heating van. Silverfox do these in green (but as far as I am aware, not silver), make sure you tell them to paint the roof black instead of light grey!

Now, wagons.

The vast majority of freight in West Cork was in covered vans. Cement and fertiliser, both of which have to be kept dry, formed a major part of it, with sugar beet between Christmas and the end of February. Here you will need Provincial Wagons. Ping Leslie McAllister, who you will see has posted above, and he does kits of basically everything you'll need.

- Cattle wagons

- Open corrugated goods trucks - these would form about 50% of all the OPEN wagons - the rest normal wooden sides at that point.

- Old GSWR goods brake van; each train must have a guard's van at the end - no fully braked wagons then.

- Above all, the standard CIE goods van, or "H" van.

John Mayne in Noo Zealand, or JM Design, is currently doing a very nice standard CIE wood-planked guard's van. One of these is a nice contrast with the old crates of things of ancient GSWR origin (Leslie's kit) which the "main line" appear to have dumped two or three of in West Cork, when old CBSCR ones fell to bits!

Wagon liveries are easy - just take your whole fleet and swirl them in a sink full of grey paint (Do not try this at home; may contain nuts.....)!

Nothing, not even roofs or couplings anything other than grey!

Add to this the fact that there are several Hornby / Bachmann / Dapol types of wagon which once repainted are fairly reasonable approximations to some CIE wagons, and you've more than enough there to get a good West Cork layout going.

I'm sure I've left out something...but that's a start.

Good luck!

[Westcorkrailway]

9 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

Westcorkrailway, it is indeed greatly inspiring to see folks your age getting involved.

You are absolutely right in all the points you make. When I was your age, dangerously close to fifty years ago, steam was only just gone (in the north, anyway; a little longer on CIE), but I was personally interested in stuff that would have been operating in the period just before I was born, and when I was too young to remember. I retain that interest today. My father, born in 1918, was fascinated with the railways of the 1900-25 period, and recalled the first time he saw carriages painted in the "new" GSR maroon, instead of a somewhat duller, older shade used by the DSER on the Harcourt St. line in Dublin, in which he travelled to school for a time.

Your interest, being in the West Cork system, is commendable. Even I don't remember that, as it was closed before I started school, and there was the small issue of me never being in that neck'o'the woods anyway. However, there are some short cuts for you.

Your long-term goal may be a couple of the brass kits of "Bandon Tanks" from Studio Scale Models (practice soldering etc., on something small and cheap first!), but there are several things you could look at to start with.

LOCOMOTIVES

Roderick Bruce of "00 Works" is about to do a Cork, Bandon & South Coast 0.6.0 saddle tank loco - now, there were only a few, and the last one expired about 1943 - but "poetic licence" will allow you to pretend that one lasted later. This will be a ready-to-run model and may well be available right now - I haven't checked for a while. It's pricey - but a word with Santa Claus might prove fruitful - that's what I ended up appealing to when I was 17!

Silverfox Models (google him) will do a kit of a "C" class - the only type of diesel that ran all over the West Cork system, and monopolised most services - goods and passenger - by the time the line closed, bar the Bantry passenger train which was a railcar. A filthy silver one and a green one will do the job.

Silverfox also do a railcar set. Who knows, maybe a ready-to-run AEC set will appear in the future, but this one might start you off. get a two-car one.

Once you master brass building, or if you know anyone who can help, Studio Scale Models and Worsley Works also do several bogie coaches of the period - Laminates, Bredins and Park Royals. One or other of these is a good thing as a centre car for the railcar set; if there was a GAA special or something, the AEC railcar set could be 4 carriages.

Older wooden coaches for Baltimore or Clonakilty tended to be GSWR types, with some old GSWR and MGWR six-wheelers used on excursions. Hattons will be bringing out six-wheelers - a repaint of one into CIE green might do? (I've no idea what livery they are). Studio Scale and Worsley also do KITS of GSWR six-wheelers. Then there were the Bachmann "CIE" green coaches out of train sets with "Woolwich" locos - while the loco is inappropriate for West Cork, the coach would do you for a Clonakilty branch train.

All trains hauled by "C" class diesels will need a luggage / heating van. Silverfox do these in green (but as far as I am aware, not silver), make sure you tell them to paint the roof black instead of light grey!

Now, wagons.

The vast majority of freight in West Cork was in covered vans. Cement and fertiliser, both of which have to be kept dry, formed a major part of it, with sugar beet between Christmas and the end of February. Here you will need Provincial Wagons. Ping Leslie McAllister, who you will see has posted above, and he does kits of basically everything you'll need.

- Cattle wagons

- Open corrugated goods trucks - these would form about 50% of all the OPEN wagons - the rest normal wooden sides at that point.

- Old GSWR goods brake van; each train must have a guard's van at the end - no fully braked wagons then.

- Above all, the standard CIE goods van, or "H" van.

John Mayne in Noo Zealand, or JM Design, is currently doing a very nice standard CIE wood-planked guard's van. One of these is a nice contrast with the old crates of things of ancient GSWR origin (Leslie's kit) which the "main line" appear to have dumped two or three of in West Cork, when old CBSCR ones fell to bits!

Wagon liveries are easy - just take your whole fleet and swirl them in a sink full of grey paint (Do not try this at home; may contain nuts.....)!

Nothing, not even roofs or couplings anything other than grey!

Add to this the fact that there are several Hornby / Bachmann / Dapol types of wagon which once repainted are fairly reasonable approximations to some CIE wagons, and you've more than enough there to get a good West Cork layout going.

I'm sure I've left out something...but that's a start.

Good luck!

Thanks for the info, the good thing is ive years to build it up...because unless i win the lotto it will take a while to build it up! The colour of the roof of through aec railcar is like the colour the wagons should be! Anyway there are two of us young lads out in this neck of the woods building cbcsr collections if not more, hence my reasoning for either go 1960s or 2000s might be the direction IRM, MM or any of our other fantastic manufacturers should head. I know the demand is high for the 70s-90s era hence why everything is sold out! (Anything general motors will be 200 euro second hand within 2 years unless somone re releases or re tools them as mad as that sounds bar the lima 201s). I'm surprised we haven't had an RTR steam loco in years or the IE 201 never got propper coaching stock but thats what i would want from the next 5 years, 201 IE with coaches and an unspecified RTR irish steam loco weather it be a J15, merlin or maebh something preserved anyway (if somone coughed up 15000 pounds 464 would be on that preserved list!)

[jhb171achill]

On 20/1/2021 at 12:31 AM, Patrick Davey said:

....and the NCC Jinty...... but don't forget the OO Works locos......... 

Indeed, though I was thinking of west Cork....

[jhb171achill]

1 hour ago, Westcorkrailway said:

Thanks for the info, the good thing is ive years to build it up...because unless i win the lotto it will take a while to build it up! The colour of the roof of through aec railcar is like the colour the wagons should be! Anyway there are two of us young lads out in this neck of the woods building cbcsr collections if not more, hence my reasoning for either go 1960s or 2000s might be the direction IRM, MM or any of our other fantastic manufacturers should head. I know the demand is high for the 70s-90s era hence why everything is sold out! (Anything general motors will be 200 euro second hand within 2 years unless somone re releases or re tools them as mad as that sounds bar the lima 201s). I'm surprised we haven't had an RTR steam loco in years or the IE 201 never got propper coaching stock but thats what i would want from the next 5 years, 201 IE with coaches and an unspecified RTR irish steam loco weather it be a J15, merlin or maebh something preserved anyway (if somone coughed up 15000 pounds 464 would be on that preserved list!)

Ah, a RTR Bandon Tank, “Merlin” or 800!! - now THAT would be nice. And you could have one in lined green - a nice change from the universal filthy plain grey used on everything else in West Cork after 1925!

On the livery subject, youve the several unique unlined versions of the green livery for older coaches that were the result of “local” one-off jobs too. 
 
You mentioned wagons - many of the older types in west Cork were an older, darker shade, almost as dark as locomotives..... 

The railcars - one at least had stripes on the front part of the cab roof, although these were, of course, switched and swopped with the main line. You mention the roofs - darker than wagons or locos - either an extremely dark grey (almost black) or black in most cases.

Then you’ve the famous tale about the stations, which I’m sure you’re well aware of - the old CIE trick of spending a fortune painting them to artificially rack up the cost of maintaining the line - in order to justify closing it! Some stations were subjected to this, getting a very bright MGWR-esque red and cream paint scheme not long before closure....

Anyway, whatever way you go, the very best of luck, and you know you’ve a good crowd on here to assist if you need it. As you say, you’ve loads of time. I’ve been at it - on and off - for decades and I hope I’m not done yet....

Edited January 21, 2021 by jhb171achill

[NIRCLASS80]

I would imagine accurate  Mk3 coaches in all variants would still sell well given the amount of orange locos out there to pull, or push them. 
Also If the moulds can be manufactured in such a way that Irish and UK models can be produced accurately then it spreads the projects overall costs, but it would be a massive project. 

[Westcorkrailway]

4 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

Ah, a RTR Bandon Tank, “Merlin” or 800!! - now THAT would be nice. And you could have one in lined green - a nice change from the universal filthy plain grey used on everything else in West Cork after 1925!

The list doesn't stop there, SLNCR 0-6-4t, MGWR J18, ex DSER 461, the U2's...and plenty more steam locos that could be candidates for being the first irish RTR exclusive tooling steam loco, althougg really it should be Maebh or Merlin, they simply are the Irish equivilent to flying Scotsman 

 

The grey was pretty bland, but i do like the jet black colour with yellow decals they repainted the likes of 201, 90 and 464 for the IRRS excursions, crisp and simple.

[Andy Cundick]

Can i start a list of what i don't want coming out as ready to run as i've already built it,Andy.

[DJ Dangerous]

6 minutes ago, Andy Cundick said:

Can i start a list of what i don't want coming out as ready to run as i've already built it,Andy.

Chances are that list will be identical to the list of future releases.

[Westcorkrailway]

21 minutes ago, Andy Cundick said:

Can i start a list of what i don't want coming out as ready to run as i've already built it,Andy.

You could build something as obscure as a CMDR inspection car if such a thing ever existed and an RTR version will be out the within the week!

[Mike 84C]

Lots of very interesting and well reasoned comments on this thread. For my two pennorth, quite a few years back I suggested getting 461 scanned  and getting the makings of a kit. As I remember posters on here came up with a number of legitimate reasons why a kit was not a good idea, others offered to go and scan 461 if money could be found. My feeling is and K801 has hit the nail on the head, younger people will buy models of what they see and for me that puts 461 and No4 right in the frame and does not take any sales away from the likes of SSM or 00 works which I feel is very important as their support has been enjoyed by the hobby for quite a while.

 As for a model of 800, a little work around a Mainline/ Bachmann Scot or rebuilt Patriot should present a reasonable model, I'll post pictures if mine ever gets finished!

Over here in GB a friend whose son, in his twenty's,  works for one of the TOC's has a very busy railway in his loft, when I visit its all action but one unit looks the same as another a 66 looks like a 66 but all in very different liveries.  No Kings, Duchess's, A4's, Brittania's but he models what he see's.  But that is not for me, steam and first generation diesels will do nicely.

[jhb171achill]

6 hours ago, Westcorkrailway said:

The list doesn't stop there, SLNCR 0-6-4t, MGWR J18, ex DSER 461, the U2's...and plenty more steam locos that could be candidates for being the first irish RTR exclusive tooling steam loco, althougg really it should be Maebh or Merlin, they simply are the Irish equivilent to flying Scotsman 

 

The grey was pretty bland, but i do like the jet black colour with yellow decals they repainted the likes of 201, 90 and 464 for the IRRS excursions, crisp and simple.

Yes, I think 90 was painted black about 1958, also the “big” engine - I think it was the only one of those in black. Yes, the grey was indeed bland, more so when filthy. The numbers were a dark cream / pale yellow, rather than bright yellow as they appear in some colour slide renditions. Flying snails on tenders were pale green, never yellow - but with no tender locos in West Cork you don’t have to worry about that!

I saw recently someone was 3D-printing a J30....

A RTR J18 would be a very useful yoke to have, so would a J26, the MGWR tank engine type seen as far away from the Midland as Fenit, Tramore......AND West Cork!

[jhb171achill]

8 hours ago, Westcorkrailway said:

You could build something as obscure as a CMDR inspection car if such a thing ever existed and an RTR version will be out the within the week!

Funny you say that, an IRM guy showed me the test sample today...

[Mayner]

11 hours ago, Andy Cundick said:

Can i start a list of what i don't want coming out as ready to run as i've already built it,Andy.

I went through a phase of modelling large BR steam locos from DJH and Comet kits about 20 years ago.

Great sense of achievement building one loco a year despite being followed a year or so later by a Bachmann or Hornby rtr version.

Some friends in the UK even thought my West Country Pacific was a Hornby pre-production version.

 

[Westcorkrailway]

7 hours ago, Mayner said:

I went through a phase of modelling large BR steam locos from DJH and Comet kits about 20 years ago.

Great sense of achievement building one loco a year despite being followed a year or so later by a Bachmann or Hornby rtr version.

Some friends in the UK even thought my West Country Pacific was a Hornby pre-production version.

 

At least you have the satisfaction of "I made that" and if your friends thought they were production samples they must have been someway decent. I'm sure the people who got the lima 201s around 2010 don't have the same satisfaction

[Andy Cundick]

The other point is i built it so i can repair it,not something you can say about most ready to run today.Andy.

[Mayner]

12 hours ago, Andy Cundick said:

The other point is i built it so i can repair it,not something you can say about most ready to run today.Andy.

The other major benefit of building your own locos is that none that I built myself have been effected by problems with mazac rot, plastic rot and split gears that afflicted certain Bachmann, Hornby and Heljan locos introduced during the last 20 years.

Edited January 23, 2021 by Mayner