Graffiti

[iarnrod]

Trains with graffiti seems to have caught the media's attention over the last day or two, when the photos posted by Marks Models went a bit viral.

If you ever wondered how these lads get away with it, it seems like you only have to throw on an orange hi-viz and you can pretty much paint any trains to your heart's content without being disturbed in any IE depot, station or stabling point. Check out this video and you will see what I mean. IE need to up their game on security big time if this video is anything to go by.

 

Edited June 30, 2019 by iarnrod

[Kinvara-Train]

cut of the Tail

[Noel]

Scum bags. If this was the USA they'd risk being shot by police! Ridiculous that this can take place inside an enclosed railway depot building manned with engineers. No security. These kids are doing this for attention and kudos, and the youtube is giving them that.

[NIR]

Graffiti is ugly, all of it. People who say 'well some of it has artistic merit' are enablers at best, more likely wannabee gangsters, or just plain dickheads.

[minister_for_hardship]

They're hardly 'kids', these appear to be at least late teens if not 20 or 30 somethings with money to spend on cans of paint which aren't that cheap. Questions would have to be raised on where they get current branded IR vests. Further IR should pressure YouTube to remove any movies showing them at 'work' as this only gives them the oxygen and publicity these guys crave. Its also vital, where possible, to remove vandalised stock from service for cleaning. If it gets cleaned asap it's going to be a fruitless exercise for them.

I do like well executed urban art, like in Waterford and elsewhere, in a proper site, this stuff is only an imitation of what gets plastered on trains from New York to Naples. An illegible mess, the artistic equivalent of a dog p*ssing on a wall.

Edited June 30, 2019 by minister_for_hardship

[Noel]

11 minutes ago, minister_for_hardship said:

They're hardly 'kids', these appear to be at least teens if not 20 or 30 somethings with money to spend on cans of paint which aren't that cheap. Questions would have to be raised on where they get current branded IR vests. Further IR should pressure YouTube to remove any movies showing them at 'work' as this only gives them the oxygen and publicity these guys crave. Its also vital, where possible, to remove vandalised stock from service for cleaning. If it gets cleaned asap it's going to be a fruitless exercise for them.

I do like well executed urban art, like in Waterford and elsewhere, in a proper site, this stuff is only an imitation of what gets plastered on trains from New York to Naples. An illegible mess, the artistic equivalent of a dog p*ssing on a wall.

Agree it should be pulled from you tube. Criminal adults by the look of it. "aren't that cheap" you possibly making an assumption the spray cans were not stolen, assume the IR vests were stolen. Any decent Garda Investigation should be able to nail these with some local intel, loads of finger prints left too. These brats leave their signature too, so intel should point the finger in the right direction. DB might have a view.

Edited June 30, 2019 by Noel

[JasonB]

All seems a little too easy if you ask me. 

[Mr Bob]

In New York, they have reduced the incidences of this sort of criminality through education on how it affects tourism and in turn money for the city and in turn money for amenities and facilities, and of course the use of Graphitti resistant paint 

the current trend is using acid etch on the windows, which ufortunately involves replacing windows and not a quick wash down with graphitti Removal chemicals.

as for the hi vis vests, seeing as these people seem to have free run of the depots, picking up a few vests along the way is no probs. Is there no security in these places ?. The indoor scenes look well lit and the outdoor ones in broad daylight , CCTV anyone ?

its kind of worrying when you see gardai, army etc, carrying out rehearsals for terrorist attacks using bombs, etc, when crims have this type of access to our transport infrastructure, who needs bombs !!!

 

[DiveController]

Unfortunately this really isn't seen as crime by many including the Gardaí and courts.

I wonder why we discourage gricers from 'benign' trespassing when this reckless destruction occurs (rhetorical)?

Interesting to see them continue with people in the trains looking on without apparently doing anything.

When was the last time one of these idiots was run over (we can only hope, I suppose)?

[jhb171achill]

5 hours ago, DiveController said:

 

I wonder why we discourage gricers from 'benign' trespassing when this reckless destruction occurs (rhetorical)?

 

When was the last time one of these idiots was run over (we can only hope, I suppose)?

Never a truer word in the history of the internet.

I live in hope for this too!

Don't start me on druggies and joyriders! When I hear of the likes of these wiping themselves out I rejoice; “the world is now a better place”!

[RobertRoche]

Just like anything else there can't be one rule for some and a different rule for others.

[Mike 84C]

Some years ago I went on a visit to the main Paris Metro Depot. Any graffiti was instantly removed quite easily, the whole carriage was covered in a sort of clear cling film wrap which was removed and replaced. Viola!! no signature and no graffiti.  No idea what it cost though.  Has Banksy got a lot to answer for? Maybe.

JHB with you all the way.

[Broithe]

9 hours ago, DiveController said:

When was the last time one of these idiots was run over (we can only hope, I suppose)?

Quite a few on the Big Island. Although. electrocution is also a big killer.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-47404529

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/mar/21/two-graffiti-artists-dead-east-london-rail-tracks-electrocution

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6466519/Graffiti-artist-29-dies-electrocuted-railway-line.html

Etc.

[Broithe]

29 minutes ago, Mike 84C said:

Some years ago I went on a visit to the main Paris Metro Depot. Any graffiti was instantly removed quite easily, the whole carriage was covered in a sort of clear cling film wrap which was removed and replaced. Viola!! no signature and no graffiti.  No idea what it cost though. 

How easy would it be to peel the film off before spraying..?

[skinner75]

2 hours ago, Mike 84C said:

Some years ago I went on a visit to the main Paris Metro Depot. Any graffiti was instantly removed quite easily, the whole carriage was covered in a sort of clear cling film wrap which was removed and replaced. Viola!! no signature and no graffiti.  No idea what it cost though.  Has Banksy got a lot to answer for? Maybe.

JHB with you all the way.

They should cover the whole of Paris with this film so! Only time I was there ('90s), I thought it a filthy graffiti cover cesspit of a place

[Broithe]

48 minutes ago, skinner75 said:

They should cover the whole of Paris with this film so! Only time I was there ('90s), I thought it a filthy graffiti cover cesspit of a place

Graffiti is often a sort of cultural infection - once it starts, other people soon join in.

I spent a fortnight in Amboise, in the Loire valley in 1990, there was almost no graffiti anywhere, and what there was was in English.

There is a road right through the middle of Stoke on Trent, the A500, known locally as the D-Road, from its shape on the map. It has large areas of concrete that are the perfect 'canvas', yet they remain completely graffiti-free after more than forty years in a deprived, inner-city environment - though, I'm sure that, if some appeared, it would all soon be covered. I'm quite careful who I mention this observation to...

Many years ago, I painted a bird hide on a nature reserve - there was a particularly well-executed piece in the middle of one wall, involved a bird motif  - so we painted a 'frame' round it and left it, to much disapproval. But, as I predicted, no new 'art' appeared for over six months - I'm sure it would have been (re)plastered in days, if we had covered the whole thing.

[DART8118]

It is an unfortunate fact of railway life that there are many isolated places along the line that have the appearance of being neglected or abandoned by the railway owner.  Such sites are then ‘reclaimed’ by graffiti vandals whose current work only adds to that sense of being neglected or abandoned, that is, depressing places that might be unsafe and best avoided.  It's only a shot step from there to vandalising trains.  The graffiti seem to be mindlessly repetitive words that sometimes seem to be meaningless.  They do nothing for the train passenger experience.  If only that graffiti skill and energy could be harnessed and channelled into something more artful.  Perhaps then the graffiti works might be managed, limited to designated canvases and become something that might "lift the spirits" of train users.  Local authorities around the world are encouraging owners to decorate property in this way.  Some solutions are simple like the services boxes at street junctions around Dublin and others are very challenging like the local authority sponsored derelict wall mural paintings in Philadelphia.  There are many more fine examples of such street art around the world.  And then, 3D pavement art illusions take things to another level.  Perhaps there is a solution in all that?

https://www.muralarts.org/artworks/philly-rowing-2018/

https://www.muralarts.org/artworks/

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=3d+pavement+art&FORM=HDRSC2

 

https://www.choicehotels.com/pennsylvania/philadelphia/enjoying-philadelphia-art-with-a-sports-fan

Scroll down to ART ON A BIKE

8118

 

[minister_for_hardship]

18 hours ago, DiveController said:

 

I wonder why we discourage gricers from 'benign' trespassing when this reckless destruction occurs (rhetorical)?

Interesting to see them continue with people in the trains looking on without apparently doing anything.

When was the last time one of these idiots was run over (we can only hope, I suppose)?

Well, gricers have no business being anywhere the public isn't allowed to be fair without official permission or supervision. Not on a modern rail way operating at high speeds. Have heard of photographers/phone photographers doing really stupid things to get that Instagram cool pic, sometimes literally on IR metals. The past is a different planet, I don't think we should tolerate gricers swarming all over per way like they did in days of yore. If you saw the photos of the Buttevant aftermath with public wandering and gawking around cranes and lifting gear, no one in their right mind would think that's ok now, but par for the course back then.

Don't think people could have been that bothered reporting them, even if someone did, by the time the law came out they would be long gone.

There was a near miss with a few graffiti lads a couple of years ago, they are lucky to be still in the land of the living. For what it's worth the law isn't taking these offences as seriously as they should. There's a bit of boys will be boys about it all.

Edited July 2, 2019 by minister_for_hardship

[Robert Shrives]

Hi 

Recently in Bristol a set was painted while crew changed ends. Amazingly they goons politely asked the driver if he could wait while they finished. Needless to say  no unit to replace it at Bristol so it ran all day like it. My TOC has the same problem at Leicester station - 24hr manned and CCTV yet sets get a reg tagging.

Re last time killed three younger "artists" were added to Darwin awards in South London when struck by a naughty train stopping these Innocent street artists displaying there works on railway infrastructure - lines closed for the day while police picked up the evidence and body parts !  The press were all over the railway - it was to blame!!! As the late  Winsor Davis said " Oh dear .how sad , never mind ." 

15 years ago at Skipton the police intercepted a gang just before starting work , the second shift in a car sped off and due to a mobile phone the police were able to locate and place them at the scene with intent, despite lame excuses, a good day had in court, sadly shitty little fines vice a public whipping handed down... - and I am a reasonable soul.  

Back in the day at Bristol a set of parcel vans were sprayed and the youth who executed the work was captured when Hornby models of his work were uncovered- he had planned the application     - but not that well as the models were not scale length..  Trying to be reasonable if they are jobless oiks (which might be debatable in this case) give them a job on the railway in the  works to clean and repaint vehicles. 

Robert            

[Mayner]

On 7/1/2019 at 6:14 AM, minister_for_hardship said:

 

I do like well executed urban art, like in Waterford and elsewhere, in a proper site, this stuff is only an imitation of what gets plastered on trains from New York to Naples. An illegible mess, the artistic equivalent of a dog p*ssing on a wall.

You hit the nail on the head minister a lot of graffiti or tagging is tied up with street gangs claiming territory.

Tagging a train sends out a pretty strong statement in terms of claiming territory, rival gangs will tag-over each others graffiti.

In New Zealand most city councils have a unit that basically records taggers signatures and paints out unauthorised grafitti on public property, police also keep a watch on graffiti as part of monitoring and controlling gang activity.

We had a graffiti attack late one night on a construction site in Auckland several years ago, the perpetrators were not exactly under-privileged kids from the wrong side of the tracks but adults in well paid employment. 

The mupetts put themselves at considerable risk by  walking out on a ledge 5 stories up to perform their art. Luckily a neighbour spotted what was going on and took  their registration number.

Edited July 2, 2019 by Mayner

[DiveController]

Incidentally what language is the graffiti in? 

[Mayner]

6 hours ago, DiveController said:

Incidentally what language is the graffiti in? 

Depends on where in the world you are and the nationality/first language of the graffiti crew of gang members.

Tags often include crew members or gang initials or signatures.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graffiti#Tagging

We had a very interesting meeting with the local Community Constable several years ago during which he produced and interpreted whats best described as a library of local grafitti including the names of specific gangs and deciphered some of the messages. Unfortunately the police abolished the community constables and centralised everything to "improve" their service to the public .

[Broithe]

https://www.rte.ie/news/dublin/2021/1202/1264407-dart-damage/

[jhb171achill]

I agree with all of the points raised above. The cost exceeds the price of a security man with POWERS to eject these scumbags without fear of reprisal.

I think that snipers placed about Inchicore and Fairview (and other places) would do a good job.....

[David Holman]

Worst cases I've ever seen were on the Circumvesuvio Railway between Naples and Sorrento. In a pre-Covid age, a few years ago, it was impossible to know what the livery was because every square centimetre of every unit was covered with graffiti. Shame, but then with a Mafia presence still strong in the area, nobody is going to argue I guess...

[Ironroad]

1 hour ago, David Holman said:

Circumvesuvio Railway between Naples and Sorrento

I've also travelled on these trains and they blend into their environment. There's graffiti everywhere so I hardly noticed it on the trains  Graffiti is the least of the problems in Naples where to seems to be very little civic pride, to put it mildly.

[jhb171achill]

Definitely snipers, then.....

[DiveController]

2 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

Definitely snipers, then.....

Neapolitan snipers don’t use camo, the home decorated graffiti suit is the order of the day ……

Not sure about snipers in Inchicore, maybe urban camo or would hi-viz jackets be needed for working graffiti marks? 

[DJ Dangerous]

On 2/7/2019 at 10:48 PM, Mayner said:

We had a graffiti attack late one night on a construction site in Auckland several years ago, the perpetrators were not exactly under-privileged kids from the wrong side of the tracks but adults in well paid employment.

 

Thinking back to my school days, I remember one of the guys, a well-educated, pleasant, intelligent guy, got big into "tagging". He used to call himself "Rez", I think, and he and his friends called themselves the SBC, Stealth Bomber Crew.

I have no idea what their motivation was, what they got from it, why they did it, but i know that they did it a lot. They must have been around sixteen at the time, and were not deprived kids in any way.

[jhb171achill]

2 minutes ago, DJ Dangerous said:

 

Thinking back to my school days, I remember one of the guys, a well-educated, pleasant, intelligent guy, got big into "tagging". He used to call himself "Rez", I think, and he and his friends called themselves the SBC, Stealth Bomber Crew.

I have no idea what their motivation was, what they got from it, why they did it, but i know that they did it a lot. They must have been around sixteen at the time, and were not deprived kids in any way.

Were they sniped?

 

[DJ Dangerous]

Not back then, anyway!

[jhb171achill]

44 minutes ago, DJ Dangerous said:

Not back then, anyway!

Ah! I mustn’t have known them….!

[Mayner]

1 hour ago, DJ Dangerous said:

 

Thinking back to my school days, I remember one of the guys, a well-educated, pleasant, intelligent guy, got big into "tagging". He used to call himself "Rez", I think, and he and his friends called themselves the SBC, Stealth Bomber Crew.

I have no idea what their motivation was, what they got from it, why they did it, but i know that they did it a lot. They must have been around sixteen at the time, and were not deprived kids in any way.

Marking their territory in the same way as dogs & tom cats spray.  no doubt  Phd's have been written on the subject in the sociology and crimonology fields.

I nearly cracked up when our community policeman opened up his catalogue of tag signatures at a neighbourhood watch meeting and was ale to identify the individual taggers, their gang affiliations and de-cypher individual tags.

 

[jhb171achill]

15 hours ago, Mayner said:

Marking their territory in the same way as dogs & tom cats spray. 

 

 

[Tullygrainey]

 

 

In the railway station in Venice back in November 2008, I saw only one piece of graffiti. Sadly, this was it...