Class 121

[DART8118]

The blanking plug in my RPSI loco seems to be a tight fit.  Anyone got any words of advice about lifting it so that I can fit a DCC chip? 

TIA, 8118

[irishthump]

3 hours ago, DART8118 said:

The blanking plug in my RPSI loco seems to be a tight fit.  Anyone got any words of advice about lifting it so that I can fit a DCC chip? 

TIA, 8118

Grip it from above with a needle nose pliers. Then apply gentle pressure and lift it straight up.

[irishthump]

56 minutes ago, irishthump said:

Grip it from above with a needle nose pliers. Then apply gentle pressure and lift it straight up.

You can wiggle it very slightly as you do it, but ONLY a little otherwise you risk bending the pins on the plug or damaging the PCB.

[patrick]

1 hour ago, irishthump said:

Grip it from above with a needle nose pliers. Then apply gentle pressure and lift it straight up.

That has worked well for me also.

[DART8118]

All good now and running silky smooth.  Lots of discoveries to be looked forward to.  Thanks for that.

[irishthump]

4 minutes ago, DART8118 said:

All good now and running silky smooth.  Lots of discoveries to be looked forward to.  Thanks for that.

You're welcome! Glad you got it sorted. Didi you install a sound decoder?

[DART8118]

No.  For this one it's the MM0006 to get up and running with DCC.  Planning sound in the next one when it arrives.

[Georgeconna]

On 9/27/2020 at 1:24 AM, WRENNEIRE said:

Knock yourselves out people:

Key   Function 

 

F0     Headlights Front/Rear

F1     Sound on/off 

F2     Air Horn (high) 

F3     Air Horn (low) 

F4     Rear lights off/on (bonnet end)

F5     Front lights off/on (cab end)

F6     Acceleration/brake time, shunting mode/shunting speed

F7     Curve Squeal 

F8     Hand Brake 

F9     Radiator Fan 

F10   Compressor 

F11   Coupler Clank 

F12   Brake release / Brake apply 

F13   Open / Close Cab Door 

F14   Diesel manual notching (up)

F15   Diesel manual notching (down)

F16   Manual Notching Logic 

F17   Automatic Brake Emergency 

F18   Dynamic Brake

F19   Conductor's Signal 10 331 80

F20   Sound Fader

F21   Isolation Switch (disconnect diesel engine from generator)

F22   Sanding Valve 

F23   Air Dryer 

F24   RailClank (4 different Rail Clank Sounds. Select via CV164 Value 0-3)

F25   Valve 

F26   Disable Brake Squeal Sound  

Nice one Dave, Spent the last 40mins playing in the shed, The Notching is top class!

 

[Georgeconna]

Goodness me, Just noticed there is rotating axles ends on this model! Unreal!

 

[irishthump]

7 hours ago, Georgeconna said:

Nice one Dave, Spent the last 40mins playing in the shed, The Notching is top class!

 

You should try Drive Hold instead of manual notching. It basically provides the same effect but you only need to use one function key.

[Georgeconna]

Tks Thump,

Still mucking about with it. First Decoder have with that function in it. Also with 26 functions maybe its time to upgrade the DCC system now too.

No idea what 16 is - Manual notching Logic, Should that be lock?

Also the Dynamic brake, does that get used with F12?

[StevieB]

On 9/27/2020 at 1:24 AM, WRENNEIRE said:

Knock yourselves out people:

Key   Function 

 

F0     Headlights Front/Rear

F1     Sound on/off 

F2     Air Horn (high) 

F3     Air Horn (low) 

F4     Rear lights off/on (bonnet end)

F5     Front lights off/on (cab end)

F6     Acceleration/brake time, shunting mode/shunting speed

F7     Curve Squeal 

F8     Hand Brake 

F9     Radiator Fan 

F10   Compressor 

F11   Coupler Clank 

F12   Brake release / Brake apply 

F13   Open / Close Cab Door 

F14   Diesel manual notching (up)

F15   Diesel manual notching (down)

F16   Manual Notching Logic 

F17   Automatic Brake Emergency 

F18   Dynamic Brake

F19   Conductor's Signal 10 331 80

F20   Sound Fader

F21   Isolation Switch (disconnect diesel engine from generator)

F22   Sanding Valve 

F23   Air Dryer 

F24   RailClank (4 different Rail Clank Sounds. Select via CV164 Value 0-3)

F25   Valve 

F26   Disable Brake Squeal Sound  

Q

[murphaph]

The 121s didn't have dynamic brakes, right? I don't think anything Irish except the 201s had any form of dynamic brakes.

[connollystn]

What are dynamic brakes? I've heard them mentioned a lot on product review videos relating to models of American diesel locomotives.

[murphaph]

The traction motors become generators (thus helping to slow the loco) and feed current either back to the ohle or a battery (then called regenerative braking) or burnt off as heat in a resistor grid in the roof, as is the case with most US diesel electrics.

[irishthump]

2 hours ago, murphaph said:

The 121s didn't have dynamic brakes, right? I don't think anything Irish except the 201s had any form of dynamic brakes.

201's came with dynamics as delivered, but they were never used. No other Irish locos had them.

[hexagon789]

2 hours ago, murphaph said:

The 121s didn't have dynamic brakes, right? I don't think anything Irish except the 201s had any form of dynamic brakes.

For locomotives, yes. Only the IÉ 201s had dynamic (rheostatic) brakes fitted and it was permanently isolated.

None of the older GM (or MV or Sulzer) locos even had the capability - strictly tread brakes only.

[irishthump]

3 hours ago, Georgeconna said:

Tks Thump,

Still mucking about with it. First Decoder have with that function in it. Also with 26 functions maybe its time to upgrade the DCC system now too.

No idea what 16 is - Manual notching Logic, Should that be lock?

Also the Dynamic brake, does that get used with F12?

You're supposed to activate the Manual Notching logic before notching up or down. If you leave F16 off when you notch up the loco will go to Run 8 mode which makes the engine spool up to top speed. Notching down with F16 off will make the engine drop right down to idle which is called Coast. If you activate F16 first then each press of F14 or F15 will make the engine go up or down one notch. If I remember correctly to go up or down one notch you need turn F14 or F15 on then off again, if you leave them on the engine will rev all the way up or down. 

Hope that helps, it sounds way more complex than it is!

[Irishrailwayman]

Unfortunately, I know of a number of people (at least 3 so far) where the sound was muffled/distorted when the 121  MM soundchip was activated. Thankfully others including mine arrived with sound functioning well from the off.

[Noel]

On 9/27/2020 at 1:43 PM, DART8118 said:

The blanking plug in my RPSI loco seems to be a tight fit.  Anyone got any words of advice about lifting it so that I can fit a DCC chip? 

TIA, 8118

I used a wooden ice cream stick cut to width like a wooden screw driver and wedged one edge of it on the screw heads on the PCP that are just 2mm forward of the decoder and the other edge under the decoder, twisting to move the decoder up and away from the pins 1/2mm at a time alternating from one side to the other so as not to bend the pins by just lifting one side of the decoder. Yes its a tight fit. A plastic blade might also suffice or a 5mm flat screwdriver head, but if using a screw driver as a wedge, beside to rest it on the hard screw head and not the main PCB surface.

On 9/22/2020 at 1:03 PM, murphaph said:

I'll have to have a 121 in my hands before I can say if the switches can influence anything under DCC.

Noel are you using a MM decoder?

Both the MM LokSound v5 decoder and a LokSound V5 project by WheelTappersDCCsounds

[Noel]

On 9/28/2020 at 9:55 PM, irishthump said:

You should try Drive Hold instead of manual notching. It basically provides the same effect but you only need to use one function key.

Agree. Drive hold allows one to easily simulate a heavy train starting off with associated notching and trashing, and slowly braking as it approaches a station. The V5 chipset also supports coasting but I'm not sure if anybody has implemented it. Its the one thing I really like about driving Mr Sound Guys Zimo projects, genuine coasting and prototypical braking. Drive hold allows LokSound to achieve the same prototypical driving.

[DART8118]

Thanks Noel.  I managed to get the blanking plug out just using my fingers and gently lifting/alternating one side to the other as you mention.  Got the new chip fitted and then another saga began.  A long day but almost there.  Thinking of sitting up as shotgun all night to make sure none of the night crew gremlins do anything tonight.

For all that the 121 is a super model and a super runner.  some of my other locos don't stat to move until the speed get to notch 6 or 7.  The 121 starts moving at notch speed 1.   

[Noel]

11 hours ago, murphaph said:

The traction motors become generators (thus helping to slow the loco) and feed current either back to the ohle or a battery (then called regenerative braking) or burnt off as heat in a resistor grid in the roof, as is the case with most US diesel electrics.

Ah interesting. (light bulb) Basically regenerative braking like every EV. Dart has had that since the beginning.

Its brilliant in a car cause going down a long steep hill you can load the car with regen braking instead of mechanical braking (ie wear and tear) or in a HGV coming down the hill through gears to limit speed.

Edited September 29, 2020 by Noel

[DiveController]

36 minutes ago, Irishrailwayman said:

Unfortunately, I know of a number of people (at least 3 so far) where the sound was muffled/distorted when the 121  MM soundchip was activated. Thankfully others including mine arrived with sound functioning well from the off.

So is it the chip or the loco/speaker unit? Have you swapped the chips/locos to test?

Edited September 29, 2020 by DiveController

[Noel]

 

4 minutes ago, DART8118 said:

Thanks Noel.  I managed to get the blanking plug out just using my fingers and gently lifting/alternating one side to the other as you mention.  Got the new chip fitted and then another saga began.  A long day but almost there.  Thinking of sitting up as shotgun all night to make sure none of the night crew gremlins do anything tonight.

For all that the 121 is a super model and a super runner.  some of my other locos don't stat to move until the speed get to notch 6 or 7.  The 121 starts moving at notch speed 1.   

Speed step 1 yes that chassis and double flywheel motor is a super smooth runner right up there with the legendary MM 141/181 chassis if not even better. Incredible achievement to fit a precision chassis inside such a short narrow body and leave room for lights, PCB, sound decoder AND . . . AND open see through grills. 

Edited September 29, 2020 by Noel

[irishthump]

45 minutes ago, Noel said:

Agree. Drive hold allows one to easily simulate a heavy train starting off with associated notching and trashing, and slowly braking as it approaches a station. The V5 chipset also supports coasting but I'm not sure if anybody has implemented it. Its the one thing I really like about driving Mr Sound Guys Zimo projects, genuine coasting and prototypical braking. Drive hold allows LokSound to achieve the same prototypical driving.

Well it gets even better with the V5 decoders. They allow acceleration and deceleration times that are roughly 3.6 that of the V4. So if you set CV4 to maximum (255) it will take ages for the loco to coast to a stop. I have mine set up like this and also use the brake feature so I can turn the throttle to zero, let the loco coast then stop it with the brake. The deceleration value for the brake can be set independently. 
The V5’s also have a feature which allows you to set 3 different “load” settings for the loco. I have them set to mimic light engine, a light train and a heavy train. These are mapped to function keys. This basically does away with Drive Hold and Coast and makes the loco incredibly prototypical you drive.

Edited September 29, 2020 by irishthump

[DiveController]

3 hours ago, irishthump said:

Well it gets even better with the V5 decoders. They allow acceleration and deceleration times that are roughly 3.6 that of the V4. So if you set CV4 to maximum (255) it will take ages for the loco to coast to a stop. I have mine set up like this and also use the brake feature so I can turn the throttle to zero, let the loco coast then stop it with the brake. The deceleration value for the brake can be set independently. 
The V5’s also have a feature which allows you to set 3 different “load” settings for the loco. I have them set to mimic light engine, a light train and a heavy train. These are mapped to function keys. This basically does away with Drive Hold and Coast and makes the loco incredibly prototypical you drive.

 I'm not surprised to hear about the load settings. It's an  easier interface than messing about with CVs and trial and error. Set up your train and off you go.

[gm171 kk]

Scheduled for 09:30 tomorrow morning. 

 

 

[Irishrailwayman]

17 hours ago, DiveController said:

So is it the chip or the loco/speaker unit? Have you swapped the chips/locos to test?

The speaker unit - I swapped the soundchip between each model.

[WaYSidE]

Hi, i been busy since march, havnt had time to look up if either irm or murphys trains arrived, i placed an order with Irm and Marks models, didnt hear from either, i suppose there all sold now, and they forgot . i even think i paid for them on line

[Warbonnet]

Just now, WaYSidE said:

Hi, i been busy since march, havnt had time to look up if either irm or murphys trains arrived, i placed an order with Irm and Marks models, didnt hear from either, i suppose there all sold now, and they forgot . i even think i paid for them on line

Hi Wayside,

Can you email us with your order numbers and we will look into it for you? If you paid for something and it came into stock, it would be sent out to you. We would recommend you ask Mark Models too, as he is unlikely to see this message on here.

Thanks,

Fran

[Noel]

Superb service from Murphy Models. One of my MM121s had an issue with a faulty speaker, the other loco was perfect.

I emailed Murphy Models and Paddy Murphy asked me to send the loco directly back to him in Wexford street and that he would replace it.  I posted the loco back to him on Monday.  A brand new replacement loco arrived back here in the last hour complete with a note saying he had replaced the loco, and bench tested it before despatch with a sound decoder to be sure its speaker was working ok. That's superb warranty and service direct from the manufacturer. Happy days. Now its in the queue for some light weathering.Thank you Murphy Models and Paddy Murphy. I just love this 1960s era grey livery and this stunningly detailed model. Love the detail including the lighting arrangements for different variants.

 

Edited October 1, 2020 by Noel

[DiveController]

Seems to be an issue with some of the speaker units, which might be a problem as the locos sell out and replacements may not be available.

Someone commented the reselling  locos as new vs used on eBay or whatever. Problematic if its sold as new/unboxed and then has a faulty speaker when received by the next owner.

I wonder how long spare will be available for these. The problem with the 141s being finding spare bags of bits with horns and all that as time passed.

[murphaph]

I'd say PM is well annoyed with the speaker manufacturer. That's really bad luck.

[skinner75]

Could the stock speaker not be replaced with one of the 'sugarcube' ones in the future? Surely a snipping of a couple of wires & a bit of soldering would cure a dodgy stock speaker in the future, if no original spare ones were to be had?