Class 121

[irishthump]

5 hours ago, NIRCLASS80 said:

The Murphy 121’s have got a 21pin arrangement and the standard Loksound V5 chip will fit.

Paddy showed me this at Warley and Explained the fact that the internal circuit board had to be redesigned to accommodate this.  
The original board design was scrapped after the model was assembled it was found the chip wouldn’t fit within the body!

This was one of the factors that has delayed the model. Paddy was very willing to share the challenges of getting the 121’s right and I enjoyed our 5 minute chat that lasted an hour!  

That's great news! Yeah, the Loksounds are not as thin as other decoders and tend to sit a little higher. Glad he found a solution.

[WRENNEIRE]

Just been doing some light reading for when they do eventually arrive

 

[Sails]

45 minutes ago, WRENNEIRE said:

Just been doing some light reading for when they do eventually arrive

 

Does function 1 still turn the sound on and off? 

[Robert Shrives]

Like the cautionary top line of the manual, in BR days it  said much the same or "not for publication"  - like the lockdown in UK who obeys when intent of not following a rational course, would you sit in a pub with the 121 manual and tell all and sundry how to pinch one ... not hopefully you would get to far,

Looking forward to the models arrival  but good to see training in progress !

Robert  

[jhb171achill]

15 hours ago, Sails said:

Does function 1 still turn the sound on and off? 

Function “7” sends a grey one down the Mallow-Waterford line with a string of oul loose-coupled trucks!

 

(I hope...!)

[Drew]

On 3/9/2019 at 7:59 PM, leslie10646 said:

However, if my memory serves me right the British electric motors were left in place on the A and C Class with the Yankee diesel engines acting as the generators?

I didn't see a response to Leslie's question on the actual driving motors.  I did see HEP responses.  Maybe I gave up scrolling too soon. 

Also, apart from Marks Models, can I ask for a list of who else on this island will be selling the 121s please?  I don't trust Paddy's site being up to date.     Based upon a few comments which I fully agree with, I'll be cancelling my order for 3 from Hattons. 

 

 

[irishthump]

26 minutes ago, Drew said:

I didn't see a response to Leslie's question on the actual driving motors.  I did see HEP responses.  Maybe I gave up scrolling too soon. 

Also, apart from Marks Models, can I ask for a list of who else on this island will be selling the 121s please?  I don't trust Paddy's site being up to date.     Based upon a few comments which I fully agree with, I'll be cancelling my order for 3 from Hattons. 

 

 

The Brush traction motors were proven to be reliable so they were left on the A and C classes. The prime movers were replaced and some electrical equipment was updated such as the generators which I think received new windings.

[hurricanemk1c]

Yes, all the electrical equipment (Metrovick, not Brush) was original on the A and C Class locos, the latter having rewound generators to cope with the doubling of horsepower

Edited April 19, 2020 by hurricanemk1c

[Drew]

I knew there was a thread but took a while to find the shops forum. Hope my other question is answered there thanks

[exciecoachbuilder]

Hi guys, this is the 'owners manual' that came with the loco's when they were delivered. The photograph in the manual is interesting, because the loco is longer than the CIE version and the cab is about a foot lower than the CIE version. No double windows at the back of the cab, also only four steps up into the cab instead of five on the Irish version. The six wheel bogies are different too.

[jhb171achill]

Somebody had that photo on ebay a year or two ago, advertised as a CIE 121 class loco.

I contacted the seller to advise that it was, in fact, an American loco, as evidenced by the length, the six-wheel bogies, and the central coupler and absence of buffers, but he insisted I was wrong and he was right.

In an effort to make the point that its unfair to a potential buyer to put up wrong information, I persisted for a while and sent him pics of a real 121, but he remained unconvinced.

There's some eejits so blind they can't see hard fact in front of them!

I wonder does anyone know where the above "larger-121-class" actually operated? It would be interesting to know if any still exist, maybe shunting in some industrial complex in the USA?

And it's got handrails - the Irish ones were delivered without!

[NIR]

30 minutes ago, jhb171achill said:

I wonder does anyone know where the above "larger-121-class" actually operated? It would be interesting to know if any still exist, maybe shunting in some industrial complex in the USA?

Will be some standard GM switcher they can put whatever body you want onto.

The GL8, an export model

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_GL8

Taiwan, Bangladesh, Tunisia, Ireland, Brazil, so on four continents but the one in the photo might just be a sales prototype.

I had some involvement with GM/EMD and the spiel was they arrived by sea with a full tank and could pull a train away from the docks the same day!

Edited April 26, 2020 by NIR

[Old Blarney]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_GL8

http://www.trainweb.org/emdloco/gl8.htm

Additional information on this subject with photographs. Text includes our fifteen  Class 121.

 

Edited April 26, 2020 by Old Blarney

[jhb171achill]

52 minutes ago, NIR said:

Will be some standard GM switcher they can put whatever body you want onto.

The GL8, an export model

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_GL8

Taiwan, Bangladesh, Tunisia, Ireland, Brazil, so on four continents but the one in the photo might just be a sales prototype.

I had some involvement with GM/EMD and the spiel was they arrived by sea with a full tank and could pull a train away from the docks the same day!

Interesting, NIR.

The late Tony O'Shaughnessy had an interest that few knew of in Scandanavian railways and he sent me some vid clips some years ago of Norwegian GMs. They sounded EXACTLY like a 141 to me, but didn't look remotely like a typical EMD product. Any idea what they were? I've long since deleted the clips.

[RichL]

43 minutes ago, jhb171achill said:

Interesting, NIR.

The late Tony O'Shaughnessy had an interest that few knew of in Scandanavian railways and he sent me some vid clips some years ago of Norwegian GMs. They sounded EXACTLY like a 141 to me, but didn't look remotely like a typical EMD product. Any idea what they were? I've long since deleted the clips.

see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSB_Di_3

Nohab locomotives

[jhb171achill]

Yes! that's the one....  listen to youtube clips of those beasts revving up.... I think there may be preserved examples in Norway.

[WRENNEIRE]

[Midland Man]

Nice diagram @WRENNEIRE

i think CIE made ones for the 071 and 141 class's as well. Saw one on the internet once but can not find it any more.

[irishthump]

2 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

Interesting, NIR.

The late Tony O'Shaughnessy had an interest that few knew of in Scandanavian railways and he sent me some vid clips some years ago of Norwegian GMs. They sounded EXACTLY like a 141 to me, but didn't look remotely like a typical EMD product. Any idea what they were? I've long since deleted the clips.

 

Yeah these locos use the same EMD 567 engine as the 141/121's. Except it's the larger 16 cylinder version as opposed to the 8 cylinder one in the 141/121's. But the sound is almost indistinguishable!

Edited April 26, 2020 by irishthump

[NIR]

Hmmm... can anyone else see a 'flying snail' on that NSB loco?

 

[jhb171achill]

3 hours ago, NIR said:

Hmmm... can anyone else see a 'flying snail' on that NSB loco?

 

Gawd bless your eyesight, NIR!   Maybe a "flying pitchfork"? Or a Scandinavian beer bottle opener?

[Mayner]

9 hours ago, RichL said:

see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSB_Di_3

Nohab locomotives

Nohab was the major European supplier of EMD powered locos in the 50s and 60s. The double cabbed Nohab like the NSB Di3 was basically the European equivalent of the EMD F7, Clyde Engineering produced similar locos in Australia.

Interestingly Nohab tendered to supply diesel locomotives to the GNR(B) and possibly CIE, but would have been too heavy and too expensive at the time.

The Victorian Railways B Class are probably close to what a Nohab loco could have looked at in GNR(B) colours https://www.victorianrailways.net/motive power/bdiesel/bdie.html

[Fiacra]

16 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

I wonder does anyone know where the above "larger-121-class" actually operated? It would be interesting to know if any still exist, maybe shunting in some industrial complex in the USA?

Looks like these ones ended up in Taiwan

Edited April 27, 2020 by Fiacra
Correction of hyperlink

[leslie10646]

Re the Nohab diesel. Fleischmann used to make one - obviously in HO.

See:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fleischmann-danische-NOHAB-Diesellok-MY/402245656044?hash=item5da7b59dec:g:rQ4AAOSwWSJepeIS

Belgium, SNCB:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/188HO-Fleischmann-HO-1385-Diesellok-Nohab-202016-grun-gelb-SNCB/352874373859?hash=item5228f3a2e3:g:~ZUAAOSwYAdd48te

Also MAV (HUngary) had them and I've got at least one trip with them, as one is preserved.I can't see a Fleischmann version of the Hungarian version as Hungary was behind the Iron Curtain when it was in production!

These days ROCO make the Nohab as well.

Quick paint job .......

Edited April 27, 2020 by leslie10646

[exciecoachbuilder]

15 hours ago, Midland Man said:

Nice diagram @WRENNEIRE

i think CIE made ones for the 071 and 141 class's as well. Saw one on the internet once but can not find it any more.

Is this the one that you are referring to?

[exciecoachbuilder]

Here is a 141 class manual.

[exciecoachbuilder]

7 minutes ago, exciecoachbuilder said:

Here is a 141 class manual. Apologies for the crappy photographs...

 

[Noel]

It would be great to see basic driving instructions or a youtube on the basics of driving an EMD loco, basic controls etc, instrumentation, brake management, etc

Edited April 27, 2020 by Noel

[Railer]

3 minutes ago, Noel said:

It would be great to see basic driving instructions or a youtube on the basics of driving an EMD loco, basic controls etc, instrumentation, brake management, etc

Look up train sim world on YouTube. There's a start up of an EMD GP38 or try a UK class 66 for something close to a 201 but with a very different desk layout. 

I'm very into the various German routes on it myself. The UK routes set in the 80s with 31s, 37s and 40s are all great fun too.

Anyway, back on topic......

[jhb171achill]

July 1976 - a pair of 121s about to leave Heuston on, as far as I recall, a stopping Cork train. They were quite newly painted.

[Blu Bianco]

On 4/26/2020 at 5:59 PM, irishthump said:

 

Yeah these locos use the same EMD 567 engine as the 141/121's. Except it's the larger 16 cylinder version as opposed to the 8 cylinder one in the 141/121's. But the sound is almost indistinguishable!

What a sound! Really miss that. 

Were a fair few NOHAB's (and similar) in Belgium (Class 52-54) and Luxembourg (Class 1600) also. I think Luxembourg have preserved a fair few of them.

[spudfan]

NMJ

The above are HO by NMJ and are €199 for the basic. Sound equipped is extra. They do other liveries as well.

Here is the                                              

• NMJ Topline Nohab Collection https://en.nmj.eu/nmj/nmj-nohab-collection.html?p=5

Edited May 30, 2020 by spudfan

[Blu Bianco]

12 hours ago, spudfan said:

NMJ

The above are HO by NMJ and are €199 for the basic. Sound equipped is extra. They do other liveries as well.

Here is the                                              

• NMJ Topline Nohab Collection https://en.nmj.eu/nmj/nmj-nohab-collection.html?p=5

Thanks Spudfan.

Some liveries do look better than others, there are a few which could feasibly be seen in geographical area I'm interested in. 

[Irishrailwayman]

On 3/27/2020 at 9:24 AM, Noel said:

WheelTappers did a 121 sound project for me using the 645E prime mover. I understand the 121s ended up being re-engined with the same motors as the 181s.

Am I correct in saying that engines for some 121s were taken from obsolete  C/201s (which had in their turn been re-engined when their Crossley engines were discarded)?

[Noel]

2 hours ago, Irishrailwayman said:

Am I correct in saying that engines for some 121s were taken from obsolete  C/201s (which had in their turn been re-engined when their Crossley engines were discarded)?

The 121s as far as I remember reading came new with EMD 567 and were later re-engined with EMD 645W but don't know if they were taken from already re-engined C class or just as part of the programme for upgrading the original 141 locos. Would be interesting to know. CIE changing to a US manufacturer instead of the unreliable British crossley engines must have been a politically sensitive decision at the time as it was for the young free state to go with Germany's Siemens suckert in the interwar period for the Ardnacrusha scheme and the first incarnation of the national grid.