LIMA Murphy Models

[WRENNEIRE]

Thank you Bhoyo, its because of comments such as yours that I do this, makes it all worthwhile

[Georgeconna]

Would not think so Dave, The 3 i have did not...Maybe I should bring them back.

[WRENNEIRE]

I was talking to a few forum members about the Lima/Murphy Models Mark 3's

I mentioned a standard with a 74xx prefix that I had seen

One of the lads remembered it but the others were not aware of its existence

Anyone have one of these in a set?

My one is a loose one that I picked up back in the day, it does not seem to have been catalogued by Murphy Models

 

 

[burnthebox]

For what it's worth, I have a set with the following numbers. 7129, 7411, & 7151, is this what your talking about,

[WT CLASS 2-6-4T No. 4]

For what it's worth, I have a set with the following numbers. 7129, 7411, & 7151, is this what your talking about,

 

Mr Murphy appears not to have been as diligent in the detail in the early years as he was up until recently. 71xx should be a first class, 7151 a composite coach and 74xx a diner. I hope he's not slipping back to his old ways as has happened with the new Mk2D's finish.

[DiveController]

For what it's worth, I have a set with the following numbers. 7129, 7411, & 7151, is this what your talking about,

That set is probably correctly numbered, Paul, because it has two standard coaches the 71XXs and a restaurant which should correctly have a 74XX number. The coach in Wrenn's photos is a STANDARD coach , not a restaurant, but incorrectly has been numbered 7411 (which should be reserved for a restaurant coach). It seems that some of the standard may have been misnumbered, probably not too many as few people are aware of it.

 

Mr Murphy appears not to have been as diligent in the detail in the early years as he was up until recently. 71xx should be a first class, 7151 a composite coach and 74xx a diner. I hope he's not slipping back to his old ways as has happened with the new Mk2D's finish.

 

WT, things have certainly slipped lately, but you also raise a good point as these should probably be numbered 72XX as neither is designated as a first class or composite on the doors

[WRENNEIRE]

Mr Murphy appears not to have been as diligent in the detail in the early years as he was up until recently. 71xx should be a first class, 7151 a composite coach and 74xx a diner. I hope he's not slipping back to his old ways as has happened with the new Mk2D's finish.

 

I find the last sentence in this post a terrible slight on Murphy and I would ask you to withdraw it.

Remember he is dealing with people thousands of miles away

When the original Lima models were produced for him he was taking their advice on what he should produce

Take for example the L105100X33 Set, the very first pic on this thread, Cl 33/A Class with a Mk 2 & Mk 3 coach

Anyone with a good knowledge of loco and coach running would never have put these 3 items together

This was the package that was sold to him and he went for it

As a result of this he then commissioned the 201 as the first truly Irish RTR model loco.

The mistake with the 7411 was caused in the Lima factory, not by Murphy

7411 in standard form was never catalogued. He would have had to open each pack and check for it

Again the new coach's were painted in China, not D4

He placed an order for these coaches, approved the pre production samples but what arrived was not what was ordered

He is still in discussion with the factory and he is not a very happy bunny over their handling of the issue

He feels his reputation has been tarnished by their bad work, not his, and this whole event may place the 121 project in jeprody

Unfortunately unlike a lot of the keyboard assassins here he is only human.

[rebelred]

I find the last sentence in this post a terrible slight on Murphy and I would ask you to withdraw it.

Remember he is dealing with people thousands of miles away

When the original Lima models were produced for him he was taking their advice on what he should produce

Take for example the L105100X33 Set, the very first pic on this thread, Cl 33/A Class with a Mk 2 & Mk 3 coach

Anyone with a good knowledge of loco and coach running would never have put these 3 items together

This was the package that was sold to him and he went for it

As a result of this he then commissioned the 201 as the first truly Irish RTR model loco.

The mistake with the 7411 was caused in the Lima factory, not by Murphy

7411 in standard form was never catalogued. He would have had to open each pack and check for it

Again the new coach's were painted in China, not D4

He placed an order for these coaches, approved the pre production samples but what arrived was not what was ordered

He is still in discussion with the factory and he is not a very happy bunny over their handling of the issue

He feels his reputation has been tarnished by their bad work, not his, and this whole event may place the 121 project in jeprody

Unfortunately unlike a lot of the keyboard assassins here he is only human.

 

Here, here Wrenneire, if anyone thinks they can do a better job then best of luck, you'll need it. I'll continue to support Murphy's Models & his (hopefully ) any future releases!

[Tarabuses]

I find the last sentence in this post a terrible slight on Murphy and I would ask you to withdraw it.

Remember he is dealing with people thousands of miles away

When the original Lima models were produced for him he was taking their advice on what he should produce

Take for example the L105100X33 Set, the very first pic on this thread, Cl 33/A Class with a Mk 2 & Mk 3 coach

Anyone with a good knowledge of loco and coach running would never have put these 3 items together

This was the package that was sold to him and he went for it

As a result of this he then commissioned the 201 as the first truly Irish RTR model loco.

The mistake with the 7411 was caused in the Lima factory, not by Murphy

7411 in standard form was never catalogued. He would have had to open each pack and check for it

Again the new coach's were painted in China, not D4

He placed an order for these coaches, approved the pre production samples but what arrived was not what was ordered

He is still in discussion with the factory and he is not a very happy bunny over their handling of the issue

He feels his reputation has been tarnished by their bad work, not his, and this whole event may place the 121 project in jeprody

Unfortunately unlike a lot of the keyboard assassins here he is only human.

 

Thanks for the insight about Paddy's problems with his Chinese factory. I presume he had paid in advance and so could not send the coaches back when found to be incorrect. It is a terrible situation for him to be in especially when the errors are laid at his door. It just shows that no one should criticise unless they know the full facts.

[Noel]

I find the last sentence in this post a terrible slight on Murphy and I would ask you to withdraw it.

Remember he is dealing with people thousands of miles away

When the original Lima models were produced for him he was taking their advice on what he should produce

Take for example the L105100X33 Set, the very first pic on this thread, Cl 33/A Class with a Mk 2 & Mk 3 coach

Anyone with a good knowledge of loco and coach running would never have put these 3 items together

This was the package that was sold to him and he went for it

As a result of this he then commissioned the 201 as the first truly Irish RTR model loco.

The mistake with the 7411 was caused in the Lima factory, not by Murphy

7411 in standard form was never catalogued. He would have had to open each pack and check for it

Again the new coach's were painted in China, not D4

He placed an order for these coaches, approved the pre production samples but what arrived was not what was ordered

He is still in discussion with the factory and he is not a very happy bunny over their handling of the issue

He feels his reputation has been tarnished by their bad work, not his, and this whole event may place the 121 project in jeprody

Unfortunately unlike a lot of the keyboard assassins here he is only human.

 

Very fair comment. The glass is more than 90% full as far as I am concerned with this vendor. Changed the whole hobby here in Ireland for the better. Ok, there can be ups and downs, and when there is a problem its fair to highlight it, but there have been vastly more positives than negatives. However in the future I would prefer to pay significantly more for a Bachmann produced 121 loco model than the plant in China that produced the more recent 201s. IMHO, the MM/Bachmann manufactured 141/181s have not been equaled nor surpassed for supreme running and quality detailed finishes - they are sublime in every respect. Business can be full of risks and one can only wish MM well.

[NIRCLASS80]

I think one of the items that is a common part between the 121 and 141/181 classes is the bogies, so hopefully to use the mold already made means that MM will use Bachmann manufacturing facilities to keep costs down.

What name that is on the box that it comes in won't worry me.

The recent problems with paint colour and quality of masking have no doubt effected sales and I just hope that this doesn't create a cash flow problem that will ultimately effect the timing of a 121 release.

MM quality is as good as any manufacturer of models as all the companies supplying the UK and even the North American markets have had serious mistakes.

 

These are just my opinions.

[Weshty]

Paddy Murphy is the MAN. A few minor quibbles with numbers and paint don't detract from the steamingly high quality and detail of his locos and coaches.

 

He didn't so much raise the bar for Irish RTR as put it into geosynchronous orbit.

 

If in doubt weather them and stand back in awe at the detail! Particularly the loco bogies.

[BosKonay]

He didn't so much raise the bar for Irish RTR as put it into geosynchronous orbit.

 

After forging the bar first with his bare hands!

[RedRich]

Very fair comment. The glass is more than 90% full as far as I am concerned with this vendor. Changed the whole hobby here in Ireland for the better. Ok, there can be ups and downs, and when there is a problem its fair to highlight it, but there have been vastly more positives than negatives. However in the future I would prefer to pay significantly more for a Bachmann produced 121 loco model than the plant in China that produced the more recent 201s. IMHO, the MM/Bachmann manufactured 141/181s have not been equaled nor surpassed for supreme running and quality detailed finishes - they are sublime in every respect. Business can be full of risks and one can only wish MM well.

 

Noel I assume you have 141-181 class and 071 class models. Both models were produced in the same manufacturing plant by the same people. The cabs, the antenna's, the glazing, the roof horns and, buffer's have been re-used from the 141-181 models. The buffer's on the 071's are actually slightly different and heavier than those fitted to the babies on the prototypes. It doesn't bother me that they were reused as I love the models. If or when a 121 is produced it won't be by Bachmann it will be by MM. I feel supremely confident that a 121 from the MM stable will be a fantastic model. If it would be possible to make the side grilles see through without any of the chassis block showing, it would be amazing.

 

Rich,

[Noel]

Noel I assume you have 141-181 class and 071 class models. Both models were produced in the same manufacturing plant by the same people. The cabs, the antenna's, the glazing, the roof horns and, buffer's have been re-used from the 141-181 models. The buffer's on the 071's are actually slightly different and heavier than those fitted to the babies on the prototypes. It doesn't bother me that they were reused as I love the models. If or when a 121 is produced it won't be by Bachmann it will be by MM. I feel supremely confident that a 121 from the MM stable will be a fantastic model. If it would be possible to make the side grilles see through without any of the chassis block showing, it would be amazing.

 

Rich,

 

Hi Rich, Yes I have quite a stable now of MMs incredible 141/181s, a few 071s and a single 201. I've decided to operate more of the baby GMs on our layout than the 071s as they are so versatile for mixed traffic 60s/70s use with shorter coaching stock, 2 axel loose coupled goods wagons, etc, and can double head for longer pax trains and long good trains. The 071s are also very nice especially the IE/IR tip-pex livery, but I only need two mainline express locos. The 201 looks quite out of place on our layout simply because of the era we are operating the models, and I find it just too long a loco as well as not being a fan of the prototype. I just hope any future 121 has a chassis that runs as smoothly and geared as perfectly as the MM 141/181s. I had considered cannibalising my single super train livery MM 141 into a 121 by building a cab and nose out of plasticard, adding deeper side frame panels, and respraying black and tan livery. But if MM release a 121 any time in the next 5 years, I'm happy to wait for that and buy a pair to run nose2nose. Noel

 

Noel

[DiveController]

9146 CIE Bredin/Park Royal?

I was just browsing back over Dave's thread and came accross this coach that we had discussed before. This is not a Park Royal and I don't think it is a Bredin either. Anyone know if this is prototypical of anything Irish?

[Garfield]

It's a BR Mk1...

[DiveController]

It's a BR Mk1...

 

…resprayed into Irish livery but not prototypical. I think the only BR Mk1 were GSVs?

[Garfield]

Not resprayers... Lima produced Mk1s in CIÉ green back in the 1970s. Not prototypical at all, though.

[WRENNEIRE]

To make matters worse its HO scale

[DiveController]

Not resprayers... Lima produced Mk1s in CIÉ green back in the 1970s. Not prototypical at all, though.

Yes, sorry, I meant liveried by the Lima as opposed to a post-retail respray …. and HO! Thank heavens, things have come a long way since these efforts at Irish outline

[GSR 800]

That would not be a problem today as HO scale seems to be the same as 00

[Dave]

That would not be a problem today as HO scale seems to be the same as 00

 

HO is not the same scale as OO. OO or 1:76 is 4mm to the foot and HO 1:87 is 3.5mm to the foot. Quite a noticeable difference when side by side.

[GSR 800]

Maybe so but my HO diesel Shunter works well on my OO gauge track

[Dave]

Maybe so but my HO diesel Shunter works well on my OO gauge track

 

It will as the track they use is the same, 16.5mm.

[Broithe]

That would not be a problem today as HO scale seems to be the same as 00

 

[Warbonnet]

They made them in OO too but still a horror show. I demonstrated the size difference between OO and HO on here before with a couple of class 66s http://irishrailwaymodeller.com/showthread.php/2515-HO-scale-popularity/page3?highlight=Mehano

[josefstadt]

71xx should be a first class, 7151 a composite coach and 74xx a diner.

 

I've just come across this point, so apologies if a reply has already been made elsewhere. It is not correct to say that 71xx should be a first class coach and 7151 a composite coach. The MkIII hauled stock did not follow the same convention of vehicle numbering as the MkIIs. While the EGVs were numbered 76xx and the catering vehicles were 74xx, all the general seating coaches (First, Composite, Standard classes and the Executive Coaches) were numbered in the series 7101 - 7172. There were no vehicles numbered 72xx. For example the Executive Coaches were 7161 and 7162; City Gold (2 + 1 seating) coaches were 7104, 7133 and 7156; First Class (2 + 2 seating) coaches were 7107 and 7157; Composites were 7165 to 7172 and Standard Class vehicles made up the balance. There would have been some variations in these details over the years.

[GSR 800]

Ahh that makes sense. I can't really tell the difference in the Shunter as I don't have another OO gauge Shunter to compare it.

[Noel]

To make matters worse its HO scale

 

Hi Dave. Not sure about the green ones, but this Lima Black&Tan CIE model from the 70s was 00 gauge (i.e. BR Mk1s). This model must be nearly 40yo. It's side by side with a Triang Hornby LMS Mk1 which is even older. Did PM have any part in Lima producing these. It was about the same time as the Vans were produced and the class 33s masquerading as CIE MV A classes.

 

Edited July 22, 2017 by Noel

[Noel]

Maybe so but my HO diesel Shunter works well on my OO gauge track

 

HO & OO use the same track, but they are different scales. OO models are slightly larger, however european trans have a larger loading gauge than british outline, so an HO gauge Deutsch Bahn coach is almost the same height and width as an 00 Gauge british outline coach.

 

16.5mm track is actually the wrong scale for 00 gauge (i.e. too narrow), but pretty close to scale for HO models.

[WRENNEIRE]

HO was produced first by Lima and when they realised that OO was the preferred scale here they then produced it in OO

Go back to page 30 of this thread and have a gander

MM was not involved in these models

[WT CLASS 2-6-4T No. 4]

I've just come across this point, so apologies if a reply has already been made elsewhere. It is not correct to say that 71xx should be a first class coach and 7151 a composite coach. The MkIII hauled stock did not follow the same convention of vehicle numbering as the MkIIs. While the EGVs were numbered 76xx and the catering vehicles were 74xx, all the general seating coaches (First, Composite, Standard classes and the Executive Coaches) were numbered in the series 7101 - 7172. There were no vehicles numbered 72xx. For example the Executive Coaches were 7161 and 7162; City Gold (2 + 1 seating) coaches were 7104, 7133 and 7156; First Class (2 + 2 seating) coaches were 7107 and 7157; Composites were 7165 to 7172 and Standard Class vehicles made up the balance. There would have been some variations in these details over the years.

 

Thanks for the clarification Josefstadt.

[DiveController]

I've just come across this point, so apologies if a reply has already been made elsewhere. It is not correct to say that 71xx should be a first class coach and 7151 a composite coach. The MkIII hauled stock did not follow the same convention of vehicle numbering as the MkIIs. While the EGVs were numbered 76xx and the catering vehicles were 74xx, all the general seating coaches (First, Composite, Standard classes and the Executive Coaches) were numbered in the series 7101 - 7172. There were no vehicles numbered 72xx. For example the Executive Coaches were 7161 and 7162; City Gold (2 + 1 seating) coaches were 7104, 7133 and 7156; First Class (2 + 2 seating) coaches were 7107 and 7157; Composites were 7165 to 7172 and Standard Class vehicles made up the balance. There would have been some variations in these details over the years.

That's probably worthy of a sticky for reference

[WRENNEIRE]

As some of you might be aware Granny Bracken retired recently and has made it her quest to have 98 the

cleanest and tidiest house in Raheny.

To this end she has had me pulling and dragging stuff from all over the house to be rehoused in either the garage of loft

Well low and behold if she didnt uncover some long lost treasures that were completely forgotten about, God bless her curly hair!

First one is a HO 4F but with factory fitted OO couplings, this loco was in the Lima CIE Steam Freight Set 10 3723A, page 35 of this thread

 

 

Next are the Mk 1 CIE Coaches, usually found in a 305346W Box, ( Page 33 of this thread) silver in colour but here in a 5346W Red box

 

 

Bought in the Real Capitol!!!