Irish Royalty - Park Royal Coach Next For IRM

[murphaph]

The mk1 BR vans and the Dundalk vans for sure. Probably also the "tin vans"? @jhb171achill ?

[jhb171achill]

6 minutes ago, murphaph said:

The mk1 BR vans and the Dundalk vans for sure. Probably also the "tin vans"? @jhb171achill ?

Very much so.

Throughout the lives of these coaches, they’re a modellers dream because they ran with, and among, ALL types of genny vans, mail coaches, diners and parcels brakes, with the exception of air-con stock from 1972 onwards. Therefore they are compatible with all of the following, until the last of them were withdrawn (dates in brackets):

Six-wheelers (until 1963)

Six-wheel full passenger brake (1969)

Bredins (mid 1970s)

ALL types of laminates (1986)

Cravens

Wooden-bodied bogie stock (c. 1972)

Ex-GNR stock taken into CIE stock (c. 1970 I think)

ALL genny vans; both the 4 & 6 wheeled tin vans, Dundalk and BR types.

Edited April 30, 2023 by jhb171achill

[flange lubricator]

13 minutes ago, Sean said:

what kinda EGV ran with these or was there none since they are numbered TL?

Originally they would have run with ordinary brake vans and tin vans with steam locomotives  providing heat pre 1963 , they would have run with four wheel and six wheel heating vans  in the diesel era then Dutch vans and BR Mk 1 vans and 32xx BGSV vans providing heat and power for TL fitted coaches . By the early 1980’s pretty much all the Park Royal’s would have been converted from Battery / Dynamo  lighting to TL with 220v power. 

[jhb171achill]

1 hour ago, Fowler4f said:

The Hattons 6 wheeler vans will complement the Park Royals very nicely.

For a green or silver Park Royal, all the passenger-carrying six-wheelers will too! Just stick a silver or green IRM “A”in front, and you’ve a perfect 1955-63 train.

[jhb171achill]

It’s worth adding that you’d get them in the middle of AEC railcar sets too….

So what locomotives and liveries?

A

B101

B121

B141

B181

071

C

E shunting!

Liveries:

Silver

Green

Black’n’tan 

Black

Black, yellow ends

Original brownish-orange 071 livery

Supertrain

And for the last few, 141s with “tippex” stripes.

[jhb171achill]

8 hours ago, Warbonnet said:

Commodious. Comfortable. Quirky and quintessentially Irish, the Park Royal coaches represent the maximum use of our generous loading gauge and an iconic piece of Irish coaching stock. It was about time it was represented faithfully in OO/4mm. 

A project that has been in-hand for a while now, we're delighted to bring you the news of the IRM CIE Park Royal coaches, representing these icons from the 1950s which served CIE and later Irish Rail well into the 1990s.

Check out our extensive history of these unique coaches over a tipple below...

HISTORY

 

Absolutely fantastic news.

This is a major item of importance for Irish modellers. Very well done to IRM. I look forward to seeing and getting a few!

 

8 hours ago, DJ Dangerous said:

 

I believe you were looking for a bigger challenge than just building a loco out of a box of dust, so...

How dirty did these get in real life, if "somebody" were to get roped into weathering a few rakes?

 

Like most other coaches the sides tended to be kept pretty clean. Expect roofs to be somewhat tatty, and ends, bogies and chassis caked in a patina of brake dust. It was mentioned somewhere that this pretty much amounted to a "livery" for the ends! The first ones painted in green had green ends, but later ones had the standard black ends, continued into the black and tan livery.

 

Edited April 30, 2023 by jhb171achill

[jhb171achill]

7 hours ago, murphaph said:

Quick comment/question. First of all, the new shop tabbed interface (maybe it's not that new but new to me) looks great and the exact years of service information is great too....which leads me to a question:

Did the Park Royals have a twin IR style stripe in 1984 already or is that perhaps an error in the text on the pages of the ones with the twin "tippex" stripes?

eg: https://irishrailwaymodels.com/collections/park-royal-coaches/products/park-royal-d-176-suburban-no-1389tl

I always thought the twin 3" stripes only came in 1987 but my knowledge of these particular coaches is about zero.

Correct. Until CIE became IE, they had the 6 inch upper black line like other stock did, and no lower one. All waistline white stripes on both PRs and Cravens dated from after 1987, when IE started. However it was many years before all had them - long after the last PRs were withdrawn, quite a few cravens still didn't have the "tippex-ified" variant. Only a few PRs got this, but unlike the Cravens they didn't have an orange line under the cantrail. Just the white line added at waist level.

[John-r]

What a fantastic announcement, they really do look stunning, well done lads, was trying to think of a sentence with Dutch van in it but nothing came to mind.

The images Stephen posted are sublime , they will look great on any layout especially when covering a long time frame.

[mmie353]

I do have a question on the Park Royals, as there are some at the RPSI, any possibility of a release in conjunction with the RPSI? 

[flange lubricator]

Another option https://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000306739

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 30, 2023 by flange lubricator

[seagoebox]

2 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

That late - a set of two on Waterford - Limerick. One of them - I think - was Downpatrick’s No. 1944.

This pic at Newbridge 15th June 1994 has 157 hauling a failed 015 and Park Royal coach 1944 from Limerick to Inchicore, possibly the last movement of it on IE.

[DJ Dangerous]

1 hour ago, jhb171achill said:

Like most other coaches the sides tended to be kept pretty clean. Expect roofs to be somewhat tatty, and ends, bogies and chassis caked in a patina of brake dust. It was mentioned somewhere that this pretty much amounted to a "livery" for the ends!

 

Once the weathering is a challenge for @murphaph, that's all that matters.

[BosKonay]

1 hour ago, mmie353 said:

I do have a question on the Park Royals, as there are some at the RPSI, any possibility of a release in conjunction with the RPSI? 

We have a full run of Mainline versions, as well as the ambulance versions to come in 2024  which will also give us the tooling to do the RPSI sets justice.

[StevieB]

Dreams do come true.

Stephen

 

[Horsetan]

2 hours ago, mmie353 said:

I do have a question on the Park Royals, as there are some at the RPSI, any possibility of a release in conjunction with the RPSI? 

 

31 minutes ago, BosKonay said:

We have a full run of Mainline versions, as well as the ambulance versions to come in 2024  which will also give us the tooling to do the RPSI sets justice.

Pencil me in for the RPSI Park Royals.

Also, will the Commonwealth bogies be available as spares? I have an IFM resin Park Royal here which could do with correct Commonwealths.....

[Flying Snail]

Just wondering - will we be able to avail of the 6-month payment plan, or will it be payment of the total amount due when they come into stock?

[BosKonay]

2 minutes ago, Flying Snail said:

Just wondering - will we be able to avail of the 6-month payment plan, or will it be payment of the total amount due when they come into stock?

You can add multiples to your cart and the. the ‘split payment’ installments option will appear in the cart (over €123) and you can set up installments as you wish there. 

Otherwise we just save your card details and will send you notification when they are in stock and either charge the saved card when ready to ship or you can choose another payment method then. 

[Flying Snail]

4 minutes ago, BosKonay said:

You can add multiples to your cart and the. the ‘split payment’ installments option will appear in the cart (over €123) and you can set up installments as you wish there. 

Otherwise we just save your card details and will send you notification when they are in stock and either charge the saved card when ready to ship or you can choose another payment method then. 

Excellent - thanks!

[Patrick Davey]

Ordered!

[Westcorkrailway]

Must find out which Park Royal’s are preserved.

 

1944 in downpatrick 

1419 & 1383 CURRENTLY in Inchicore (subject to change though methinks)

2 In Clonakilty (don’t know the numbers) 

 

[Niles]

56 minutes ago, Westcorkrailway said:

Must find out which Park Royal’s are preserved.

 

1944 in downpatrick 

1419 & 1383 CURRENTLY in Inchicore (subject to change though methinks)

2 In Clonakilty (don’t know the numbers) 

 

1400 and 1946 (I think they were the very last set in service,  straight off the Limerick-Rosslare).

[Mayner]

Definitely interested in the CIE Commonwealth bogies if released separately for my Worsley Works Laminates and Park Royal. 

Wonder how my Park Royal (not bad for a 1st attempt at a brass coach) will compare with the new IRM models 

 

BR (BSGV)Vans (34 total) were mainly used on Intercity trains with mixed Craven, Park Royal and Laminate stock.

Dutch vans (10 total) tended to be were less common (less popular with Guards) on Intercity Trains.   

CIE also converted 18 older coaches into TL BSGVs during the mid-late 70s to replace Tin Vans on outer suburban and branch line trains.

Apart from a suitable BSGV Van the main item missing to model a conventional 1972-1987 era  CIE Intercity train  is a Buffet Car.

 

Edited May 1, 2023 by Mayner

[Darius43]

Fantastic stuff!!!  Duly ordered

Cheers

Darius

[Noel]

20 hours ago, Warbonnet said:

Commodious. Comfortable. Quirky and quintessentially Irish, the Park Royal coaches represent the maximum use of our generous loading gauge and an iconic piece of Irish coaching stock. It was about time it was represented faithfully in OO/4mm. 

A project that has been in-hand for a while now, we're delighted to bring you the news of the IRM CIE Park Royal coaches, representing these icons from the 1950s which served CIE and later Irish Rail well into the 1990s.

Check out our extensive history of these unique coaches over a tipple below...

HISTORY

On July 1, 1948 the Irish Government asked Sir James Milne, last General Manager of the United Kingdom’s Great Western Railway, to investigate the state of internal transport in Ireland and his report, published later that year, suggested that diesel traction alone would not be the answer to Córas Iompair Éireann’s problems. Deemed inadequate to meet the needs of the population, Milne’s report highlighted that the average age of CIÉ’s coaching stock was 47 years old, with 155 vehicles being over 60 years old and that a large proportion of the vehicles had not had a general repair for over 10 years, with some not being overhauled since 1929.

Milne noted that, as at January 1, 1948, coaching stock (exclusive of the Drumm Battery trains), amounted to 1325 vehicles and of these, 1251 were broad gauge, with 369 bogie passenger carriages and 394 non-bogie passenger carriages, while other coaching vehicles amounted to 29 bogie vehicles and 459 non-bogie vehicles. Six-wheel stock was prevalent and of the 763 passenger vehicles, 155 still had no heating, and two even had no form of artificial lighting. There were only 34 coaches of what could be considered as modern design and all these vehicles were at least 11 years old.

Something needed to change.

On January 1, 1950, Córas Iompair Éireann was nationalised and within a couple of years the board of CIÉ had approved a capital expenditure programme of almost £1 million on new coaching stock under the direction of Oliver Bulleid. In September 1949 Bulleid had retired from his role as Chief Mechanical Engineer of British Railways Southern Region and was well placed to assist with the CIÉ’s move towards modernisation, having been one of three further technical assessors to Sir James Milne during his reporting phase. Bullied became a consulting mechanical engineer to CIÉ at the invitation of T. C. Courtney, the new chairman of CIE, and succeeded to the post of Chief Mechanical Engineer in February 1950, becoming the architect of the major construction programme that saw almost 500 new coaching stock vehicles entering service over the following 14 year period.

The bulk of these new vehicles were constructed of a steel-clad, wooden framed body, mounted on a steel underframe, but there were notable exceptions to this method of construction; the first of these being two sets of coaches that were supplied by Park Royal during 1955 and 1956, in which the timber framing of the body was replaced by a metal frame, and was mounted on an all-welded triangulated 61’ 6” underframe, running on Commonwealth bogies. These underframes were made in the United Kingdom, by the Wolverhampton firm of John Thompson Pressings Ltd.

Supplied in component form, the use of prefabricated components supplied by Park Royal allowed for volume construction using a semi-skilled workforce and a single bodyshell type was used for both suburban and main line use, to diagrams 176 and 177 respectively, but with different interior layouts. The body was built integral with the frame and bus pillars (unsurprisingly, given Park Royals coach building credentials) gave support, with the roof being carried on closely spaced hoopsticks, three to a bay. The bodyside was only as thick as it needed to be to carry the window frames and was sealed inside, before plywood lining panels were fitted direct to the frames. Lateral support came from two channel sectioned, externally fitted waist rails on each side, giving the Park Royals their distinctive external appearance.

The coaches made full use of the Irish loading gauge, being 61’ 6” inches long and 10’ 2” wide, this width reducing by 8” at each end, necessary to maintain gauging on curves. Due to their aluminium and steel construction, they only weighed 26 tons tare for the D176 suburban and 27¼ tons tare for the D177 main line type. Initially, two seating layouts were offered; the D176 suburban seating 82 passengers in a 2+3 arrangement, with 6 seats in each vestibule area, and the D177 main line seating 70 passengers in a similar 2+3 arrangement, but with toilet facilities at each vestibule end.

Initially both diagrams were supplied with inward opening ‘bus’ type doors, however these proved unpopular and confusing to the passengers and so the coaches were fitted with conventional outside opening doors as they next passed through Inchicore, the door window position being lowered in the process. This work was carried out by 1958 and there were no more changes to the coaches until the Train Lighting conversions during 1972, the Park Royal’s lighting initially being generated on-board via dynamo and battery.

There were, eventually, several variants in service, with two main conversions giving rise to ‘Snack Cars’, and then Brake Standards. Six main line vehicles were converted to ‘Snack Cars’ in 1968, with one vestibule end incorporating a small counter and serving area and the seating reduced to 56, before being either reconverted to main line standards or Brake Standards in 1984. In all, eight vehicles were converted to Brake Standards at this time, being drawn from Snack Car, suburban and Ambulance vehicles; the latter conversions being the creation of two Ambulance vehicles from existing suburban coaches, to convey invalided pilgrims to Knock Shrine in County Mayo. Two suburban vehicles also found use on the Waterford & Tramore Railway, one having bus seating installed to act as a 93 seat trailer, the other (No. 1408), being converted for use as a Driving Vehicle Trailer on the branch until 1960.

During the 1980s, appearances began to change, and the distinction between suburban and main line versions became blurred in some instances. Many of the coaches lost the circular window at the vestibule ends, with the remaining windows sometimes being reduced in size. On other vehicles, the water pipes on toilet equipped coaches were sometimes arranged in different configurations as pipes were renewed, and passenger communication gear was adapted, or removed entirely from the vehicle ends.

The Park Royal coaches continued in service until the early-1990s, before being barred from certain routes due to their construction, with the last few Park Royal carriages being withdrawn following the delivery of the first Japanese 2600 Class DMUs in 1994. During their period in traffic, Bulleid’s coaches carried a full gamut of liveries; the 40 D176 suburbans carrying the lighter standard overall mid-green livery, with the thinner eau-de-nil stripe carried below the windows, on the waist channelling. Vehicle ends were observed as being the same colour but were prone to extreme discolouration by weathering, and so it is difficult to ascertain whether, in the later years of mid-green application, the body ends were green, repainted black, or just merely filthy.

The ten D177 mainline vehicles initially appeared in unpainted Aluminium, with red class designations and running numbers between 1955 and 1958, before this impractical arrangement was covered with the application of mid-green, with lined Eau-de-Nil class designations. In 1962 the mid-green scheme was replaced with black upper panels, roof and body ends, and deep orange (or golden brown/tan) lower panels with a 6” white band between the windows and the roof. In 1987, under Iarnród Éireann, the 6” band was dropped and replaced with two 3” white bands, either side of the black panel, although it was possible that some Park Royals carried a single white band, reduced to 3”.

The Model

This first run of Park Royal coaches concentrates on the D.176 suburban variants throughout their service life, but also includes a couple of ex-D.177 Snack Car vehicles. We will, in time, also add the D.177 mainline versions to the range, along with BSO conversions and the two Knock Ambulance cars; AM14 and AM15.

With an unrivalled specification list such as a wealth of separately applied parts, both plastic and etched metal, with also fully detailed Irish commonwealth bogies for the first time in ready-to-run format, detail variations, wire handrails, bespoke detailed interiors depending on coach type, full interior lighting with stay alive powerpack for flicker free lighting and a die cast underframe to ensure smooth running, they offer unbeatable value at just €69.99 per coach, with our usual 10% off when you buy two coaches or more!

We are delighted to time the announcement of these beautiful coaches with the Wexford Model Railway Show this weekend, where we will have a 3D print of the final CAD on view. 

In the meantime, you can place your pre-order with no money down now via our website for a delivery date of Q2 2024. Expect to see a fully finished sample over the summer too!

Pre-order here below:

PRE-ORDER YOUR PARK ROYAL COACHES HERE

(Despite their widespread service, and longevity of service, good clear photographs of individual Park Royal coaches are rare, and so Irish Railway Models are grateful for the photographic contributions from the Irish Rail Record Society, Jonathan Allen, Colin ‘Ernie’ Brack, Neil Smith and Noel Dodd. Thanks must also go to John Beaumont for his valuable knowledge on livery issues, as well as Peter Rigney, but the final mention must go to Robert Gardiner and the volunteers at the Downpatrick and County Down Railway, who accommodated us on several survey visits.)

 Key Statistics

• Highly-detailed 00 gauge model, 1:76.2 scale on 16.5mm track
• Scale length of 246mm over body, width of 40.67mm across body
• Operation over a minimum radius of 438mm (2nd radius set-track)
• Die-cast metal chassis with plastic body.
• Accurate CIÉ Commonwealth bogies, with separate detailing where appropriate, that allows for the option of re-gauging to Irish Broad Gauge (21mm).
• Brake blocks aligned with wheels, allowing for the option of moving outwards for Irish Broad Gauge.
• 12mm wheels are blackened RP25-110 profile for 00 gauge, set on 2mm axles, 28mm over pin-points and with 14.4mm back-to-back measurement.
• NEM standard coupling sockets, with mini-tension lock couplers with a kinematic close-coupling system.
• Scale width wire handrails, water pipes, passenger communication gear.
• Headstock pipes and cabling included in accessory polybag for customer fitting, along with Kosan Gas Tank for the Snack Car.
• Fully detailed die-cast underframe with vacuum cylinders, battery boxes, dynamo and piping applied separately.
• Accurate interior layouts, with detailed seating and decorated where appropriate.
• Full guard’s compartment and kitchen/snack bar area detailing where appropriate, including use of etched metal detailing.
• Prism free flush glazing.
• Interior coach lighting with stay-alive capacitor, pick up from both bogies and a reed switch to control on/off via magnetic wand.
• Separate roof vent types, set in correct locations.

 

View the full article

[flange lubricator]

5 hours ago, Mayner said:

 

Apart from a suitable BSGV Van the main item missing to model a conventional 1972-1987 era  CIE Intercity train  is a Buffet Car.

 

The Park Royal’s share the same 61’6” underframe and commonwealth bogies as the 2419-2422 Buffet Cars unfortunately the numbers required to produce such a model may not be there to make a one off viable.

[Georgeconna]

Saw the version on the show and got to hold it, the underneath is very very impressive.

Just hope the couplings will get some level of Continental Closeness with gangways as close as possible!!

Must see which ones suit now!!

Well done IRM.

 

[BosKonay]

44 minutes ago, Georgeconna said:

Saw the version on the show and got to hold it, the underneath is very very impressive.

Just hope the couplings will get some level of Continental Closeness with gangways as close as possible!!

Must see which ones suit now!!

Well done IRM.

 

Like our mk5 and mk2, there is a full kinematic close coupling system designed so the gangways will touch on the straight.

[Sean]

but will they come with dellners? 

[Sean]

serious question btw. im expecting my first set tomorrow morning.  

[DJ Dangerous]

Just now, Sean said:

serious question btw. im expecting my first set tomorrow morning.  

Park Royals tomorrow morning???

[Sean]

no, dellners lol.

[meathdane]

Preordered a set of 4, should look the bee knees alongside Mk2s, Cravens, 4 wheelers and generic irish-ified coaches in a mixed rake behind an A class!

 

Well done lads!

[Horsetan]

1383 ordered.

[Broithe]

6 minutes ago, Horsetan said:

1383 ordered.

It would take some layout to run all of them at the same time!

[Horsetan]

Just now, Broithe said:

It would take some layout to run all of them at the same time!

I'll review the bank statement when the debit is made....